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Vash01
07-05-2011, 05:09 PM
I

Annenko & Sretenski did stick around for the 1988-89 season, but they got passed by Usova & Zhulin at 89 Euros before not showing up at Worlds. U&Z were actually the surprise of 89, not 90 (debuting in 2nd at 89 Worlds before dropping to 3rd behind the Duchesnays in 90). I don't know the details on why A&S didn't go to 89 Worlds, whether they were injured or if they saw the writing on the wall after Euros. There was some controversy around their programs that season (at Skate Canada, there was discussion of whether their Charleston was really a Charleston or more of a ragtime number) and the Duchesnays weren't at Euros, so maybe they decided there wasn't much point in going to Worlds to finish 4th again.

Yes, it was 1989- thanks for the correction. In Sun Valley, where I frequently went to those outdoor FS shows, I remember that after the 1988 Olympics, one night they have Klimova-Ponomarenko (Olympic silver medallists at that time) and an unknown pair named Usova-Zhulin who were announced as the next 'stars'. They truly were wonderful even then. It was not a surprise that they won the silver at the 1989 worlds with their 'Mars-Chopin-Mars' free skate. I still think if A&S had stuck around, they had a realistic chance of winning the world bronze. Their resume is lacking in a world medal.

judgejudy27
07-05-2011, 08:58 PM
A&S probably would have won silver at the 89 Worlds had they stayed around. The heirarchy in the Soviet Union (remember this is dance pre COP) would have kept them over Usova & Zhulin for a couple years, deservedly or not. Granted I didnt see Europeans in 89 so not sure how they skated there, if they skated well and still lost then maybe the torch had passed already.
In 1990 they would have dropped below the Duchensays too if still around.

judgejudy27
07-05-2011, 09:08 PM
Shishkova & Naumov actually dominated the 95-96 season until Worlds, not losing an event. It was shocking that when all the top pairs made mistakes in the free skate they got no benefit of doubt from many of the judges. Eltsova & Bushkov were the only top pair to not fall, their errors were a hand down on a throw and a small step out on a simple double jump. What surprised me most was Woetzel & Steuer winning silver with a sliding fall on a throw double axel, singling their only side by side double axel tries, and possibly a two footed throw. They were majorly held up (they pretty much always were overrated though)

I think they lost at the 95 Worlds since many pairs- Kovarikova & Novotny, Woetzel & Steuer, Eltsova & Bushkov, even Meno & Sand, had better seasons going into Worlds.They had alot of problems throughout the season and nobody saw them as the top pair going in as a result. They were probably already dethroned in the judges minds before the event even began, despite that they put it all together at Worlds. To win this year they would have needed both the Czechs and Germans to bomb for the judges to give it to them (skated as badly as Woetzel & Steuer did at the 95 Worlds, not just be a bit off like K&N were). Not saying this is right of course but the result didnt surprise me even after seeing how the pairs skated. It would have been a big upset for S&N to win after the season they had going into Worlds. They also skated 1st in the final flight of 4 with K&N, W&S, and E&B yet to come. As they werent seen as the frontrunners at that point the judges were leaving room for potentially all 3 pairs to beat them if they also skated cleanly, making getting the winning marks nearly impossible even when they ended up being the only of the final 4 to skate cleanly.


The worst thing for Shishkova & Naumov is 1994 was when they really hit their peak. And it was the only year the pro reinstatement was allowed. It did bring extra excitement to the whole sport, and of all the events the pairs was the most improved by it. Still it was unfair to the skaters in a large sense and rotten luck for a team like Shishkova & Naumov. They probably would have been Olympic and World Champions in 1994 had it not been for the reinstated pros and might have retired on the spot in that case and had a lucratrive pro career.

By 97-98 they were past their prime so staying or making it back to the top would have been nearly impossible. Ironically their only real hope of getting on the World and Olympic teams was not knock off Kazahkova & Dmitriev who ended up winning the 98 Olympics. Eltsova & Bushkov actually won Nationals in both 97 and 98, so must have been highly in favor by the federation at the time of the 98 Nationals, but fallen completely out of it by the time of the 98 Games (where their scores were low even for how they skated). Berezhnaya & Sikharulidze were 2nd at Nationals both years and were not only the most talented pair of the whole group, but obviously the future as these others were all nearing the end of their amateur careers.

eurodance2001
07-05-2011, 09:15 PM
I really liked these two for soem reason. I seem to remember them getting some majorly dodgy marks/ordinals at the 96 worlds LP....

You are right about this.. They got 4 first place ordinals, 2 4th places and the rest second and third and somehow dropped down, so this was ordinal flips at it's finest. Their Don Quixote program that year was entertaining so no idea why they didn't get more benefit of the doubt..

orbitz
07-05-2011, 09:52 PM
Usually the guy in the pair team has lousy extensions, but Naumov's extensions was every bit as good as his wife's. I don't think they were the most dynamic team on the ice, but I rather watch them than B&E though.

nro
07-05-2011, 11:45 PM
I also prefer watching S/N over Brasseur/truck driver and Eltsova/Bushkov. This is Shishkova/Naumov's Ave Maria, love the softness of their step sequence and their superb lines:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nxVrFEGDasw
It's a shame they weren't a bit more consistent.

liv
07-06-2011, 12:14 AM
These two were average, imo, especially compared to other great Russian pairs, but were better than Eltsova/Bushkov. They came up with a great performance in 1994 and should have won the bronze, but a Russian sweep would've been intolerable.

I can understand their bitterness over not medalling in those Olympics, especially since they actually skated very well. But, in the grand scheme of things, the best pairs in the world were at that competition, and that made it the most accurate in my view.

orbitz
07-06-2011, 12:20 AM
I can understand their bitterness over not medalling in those Olympics, especially since they actually skated very well. But, in the grand scheme of things, the best pairs in the world were at that competition, and that made it the most accurate in my view.

Yes, but the best skated pair at LiliHammer was not awarded the gold ;)

blue_idealist
07-06-2011, 12:26 AM
Yes, but the best skated pair at LiliHammer was not awarded the gold ;)

You mean M/D, right? ;)

casken
07-06-2011, 03:02 AM
96 Worlds was just bizarre. Four first place ordinals, but the other judges all had them off the podium. They skated before K&D, and I'm wondering if those judges were expecting K&D to come through like they did at Euros and wanted to prevent a Russian sweep.

What hurt them (minus any behind the scenes stuff) was using the same dull, poorly constructed "Don Quixote" LP for three years. Their skating is beautiful, but the program makes it chore to watch. I understand injury prevented them from coming up with something new for the Olympics in 98 though.

Odd to think Eltsova/Bushkov were the National Champions going into the 98 Olympics and K&D just barely made the team with a performance that was superior to the one they gave at the Olympics.

judgejudy27
07-06-2011, 03:28 AM
I never saw the 98 Russian Nationals but I heard the top 4 all skated cleanly and the results were Eltsova & Bushkov 1st, Berezhnaya & Sikharulidze 2nd, Kazahkova & Dmitriev 3rd, and Shishkova & Naumov 4th. Is this true.

casken
07-06-2011, 04:07 AM
I never saw the 98 Russian Nationals but I heard the top 4 all skated cleanly and the results were Eltsova & Bushkov 1st, Berezhnaya & Sikharulidze 2nd, Kazahkova & Dmitriev 3rd, and Shishkova & Naumov 4th. Is this true.

That's the order, although not all were completely clean.

Buskhov singled the double axe.
Sikharulidze fell on the triple toe.
Dmitriev singled the second double axel, although they did a first set cleanly before that so not a huge omission. (same as the Olympics)
S&N were the only ones to go completely "clean", though the landings of the triple toes were iffy.

All the vids are on the fsvids site in the "98 Russian Nationals" (http://www.fsvids.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=1797) thread to download if you want to see.

I thought K&D skated with more confidence at Nationals than they did at the Olympics, and they did the shoulder to shoulder lift they awkwardly left out at the Olympics as well. The Olympic performance felt like a cautious and nervy "Just don't fall and we'll win." type performance.

And what were E&B thinking (as well as the Russian judges who gave them 5.9s for presentation) with that S&M themed LOTD program? Did they really envision themselves winning the Olympics with that? It actually has some interesting transitions and stuff, but the overall effect is just weird and not in a good way.

Vash01
07-06-2011, 05:33 AM
The only thing I remember about Yeltsova-Bushkov's Olympic LP is their costume(s). They looked very strange. They did not skate well either. S&N would have done better, but how could the Russian fed not select its national champions to the Olympic team? Thank goodness K&D were selected.

essence_of_soy
07-06-2011, 06:36 AM
I was at 96 Worlds in person, and Eltsova and Bushkov were the skating equivalent of Nembutal.

Nobody in the top five skated cleanly (in the combined short and long), but Shishkova and Naumov should have made the podium.

What sticks in my memory the most was when Artur Dmitriev went off axis in the side by side spin and almost chopped Oksana Kazakova in half.

olympic
07-06-2011, 02:43 PM
^ The results between '98 Russian Nats and Nagano are amazing. :eek:

What happened in between at '98 Euros? Anything of note that may have shaken up the results going into Nagano from Russian Nats??