PDA

View Full Version : U.S. Figure Skating reprimands, fines Rachael Flatt



Pages : 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 [41] 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52

RD
06-24-2011, 03:48 PM
she was a medal hopeful (she hasn't competed in any senior international championship yet), but because she was a medal potential for the future and needed the experience. She was known to be inconsistent. I don't think anyone was placing bets on her.

Nagasu was picked for 2010 because she finished 2nd at 2010 US Nats...

Mathman
06-24-2011, 03:48 PM
In a country where the federation pays for all (or at least the majority) of training expenses, travel expenses, costume expenses, and so forth, then yes I'd say the athlete is required to let the federation know if they can't perform their best because it should be up to the federation who gets sent.

In the case of a federation like the US who pays for literally nothing and leaves their athletes to foot yearly bills totaling 20 grand or more, they should have no say. It should be up to the athlete and their family who spent all that money whether or not they feel like having completely wasted a year's worth of training expenses just for the "good of the team getting three spots". It's not a team sport when everyone pays for their own way. Everyone makes huge financial sacrifices just to keep training, and since it's their money, they should be the only ones to decide.

I agree completely with this. He who pays the piper calls the tune.

If you don't like Rachael's skating, make a contribution to the skater of your choice. :cool:

leafygreens
06-24-2011, 03:56 PM
In a roundabout way, I argued this in an earlier post: I think the USFSA has been stuck on the idea of Flatt [Ms. Consistency] + 1 princess [Alissa or Mirai] going to Worlds for the last few years, hoping that one of the 'princesses' delivers in combo w/ a steady performance by Flatt, to give the US 3 spots (if not a medal to boot from one of said 'princesses'). And I think Flatt won '10 Nats because she had the performance of her life while the reigning champ Czisny completely and utterly bombed, Nagasu was still coming back and thus perhaps not as trustworthy as a consistent Flatt, and Wagner fell in the SP. I'm sure Flatt beating an admittedly flawed Yu Na in the LP at '09 SA still set hearts aflutter among USFSA members.

While I think about it, Wagner might actually be stuck in a USFSA no-man's land: something of a powerhouse but not as consistent or CoP savvy as Flatt, and somewhat of a sparkly skater but doesn't have as much panache as either Czisny or Nagasu.

Ashley got SCREWED in 2010. Her PCS should have put her above Rachael. She had one fall in the whole competition. Her spins, speed and presentation are miles beyond the boop-boop-bee-doop. Let's be real - Sasha got 4th in 2010 for messing up ALL her landings in the LP. Ashley's presentation is a lot closer to Sasha's than Rachael's.


While I understand that Flatt didn't perform to the best of her ability either, I cannot agree that it's not primarily Nagasu's fault. Out of the two, obviously Nagasu had the potential for placing higher. After all, she came into worlds being 4th at the Olympics and- get this- THE LEADER after the short program. If she only had a couple of mistakes overall to place 7th, fine...but the girl melted down. one 2A fall away from medaling. Sorry, but Nagasu was just as big a part at the 2010 failure as Flatt was for the 2011 one.

OMG, not even in the same realm of comparison! If you are one 2A away from medaling, that's not "bombing." Mirai won the 2010 SP, unlike Rachael bombing both 2011 SP and LP, and bombing all season!

kwanatic
06-24-2011, 03:59 PM
Are we missing the Kween yet? ;)


I know, right? It's funny how people b*tched and moaned about Michelle competing and that she should step aside and let the next generation take over and how she was declining, yadda yadda yadda...what they don't realize is that from 1995 to 2005 Michelle placed 4th twice and 3rd once...every other medal at worlds was either gold or silver. We don't have that kind of sure bet in the US anymore. To be honest, I didn't even know about the whole "two placements must equal 13 for three slots" thing until 2008 or 2009 when all this talk of having only two spots came up.

Say what you will about Michelle, but she carried US ladies' figure skating on her back for a decade and we are seriously missing her presence in the sport today...

RD
06-24-2011, 04:24 PM
Flatt at the last 2 Worlds has failed to deliver a finish between 5th-8th. She has not skated close to cleanly. She has not done her expected part to help the U.S gain 3 spots.

Since her consistency can no longer be counted on to help the U.S I dont see what purpose she serves anymore.

This I agree with. Once Flatt loses her consistency, her jumps- much like another recent skater, she has nothing to fall back on and as a result, it's all downhill from there.

But my argument is that it's not really fair to blame it ALL on Flatt if we're to speak in GENERAL terms. Nagasu, Czisny, and Wagner have been on world teams and have not done their part either. Like another poster said, the US ladies just aren't as good as they once were. Until we can find TWO consistent, talented skaters (one clearly is not enough), we will continue to be stuck with two ladies spots and no World medal.

RD
06-24-2011, 04:34 PM
Say what you will about Michelle, but she carried US ladies' figure skating on her back for a decade and we are seriously missing her presence in the sport today...

True, but remember: she couldn't do it all by herself. (Case in point: Even with phenom Yuna Kim, Korea has 2 ladies spots instead of 3 because they don't have a 2nd reliable ladies skater to help her out!) It was mainly thanks to skaters like Sarah Hughes, and later Sasha Cohen, in combination with Kwan that did the trick. Once they left, Meissner and Emily Hughes were able to hold onto 3 spots, but only for 1 year. That year was 2007.


OMG, not even in the same realm of comparison! If you are one 2A away from medaling, that's not "bombing." Mirai won the 2010 SP, unlike Rachael bombing both 2011 SP and LP, and bombing all season!

Wow. I just don't know what to say to this, where to even start...HOW is dropping from FIRST after the short, to ELEVENTH in the free skate, SEVENTH overall not bombing?! Not even Cohen took that far of a nose-dive. This girl just may have been able to win the world championship if she just stayed on her feet...or at least hung on to a medal if she kept the mistakes to a minimum. Yes, Flatt was underwhelming as well...but after skating her best at Olys and placing only 7th...did anyone seriously think she would have been significant help anyway?

judgejudy27
06-24-2011, 04:36 PM
Czisny was 5th at Worlds. She did do her part. Nagasu did better than Flatt at both the 2010 Olympics and Worlds. Nagasu's role is different than Flatt's. Nagasu, unlike Flatt, has medal winning potential, and it is that possability more than her reliability that is why she is there. You know she might bomb as well. Flatt with no medal winning potential whatsoever is supposed to instead deliver solid performances and a solid placement, to atleast help the cause of possibly regaining 3 spots. She hasnt except for the 09 Worlds.

olympic
06-24-2011, 04:36 PM
I know, right? It's funny how people b*tched and moaned about Michelle competing and that she should step aside and let the next generation take over and how she was declining, yadda yadda yadda...what they don't realize is that from 1995 to 2005 Michelle placed 4th twice and 3rd once...every other medal at worlds was either gold or silver. We don't have that kind of sure bet in the US anymore. To be honest, I didn't even know about the whole "two placements must equal 13 for three slots" thing until 2008 or 2009 when all this talk of having only two spots came up.

Say what you will about Michelle, but she carried US ladies' figure skating on her back for a decade and we are seriously missing her presence in the sport today...

...what's even more ironic is how much the US should miss Sasha! During Sasha's day, she was even more criticized than MK for her one-splat performances. You just knew a mistake was coming in the big competitions. yet, I'd kill for Sasha [or someone like her] competing for the US nowadays.

I think '12 Worlds is the last best shot for US ladies to get out of this slump. Aren't the Russian Babies coming in '13? Admittedly, I don't think they will have the same impact as Yu Na or Mao in '07, but they will be 2 - 3 more big obstacles for any US lady to clear...

judgejudy27
06-24-2011, 04:39 PM
IMO Nagasu had a rightful lead over Wagner and Flatt after the short program, and the long should have been won by Wagner, followed by Nagasu and then Flatt. I would have been fine with either Nagasu or Wagner winning overall but Flatt was clearly 3rd best to me.

I agree. Wagner was clearly screwed to be behind behind Flatt that year. Poor Ashley never gets a break, she either misses something, or she skates well and isnt rewarded.

RD
06-24-2011, 04:42 PM
I agree. Wagner was clearly screwed to be behind behind Flatt that year. Poor Ashley never gets a break, she either misses something, or she skates well and isnt rewarded.

Didn't she win the freeskate portion of 2009 Nats? Unfortunately it wasn't enough to overcome her crappy short though.

I think Wagner gets VERY generous scores (at Nationals) when she does well...problem for her is, it doesn't really happen often.

Sasha'sSpins
06-24-2011, 07:11 PM
"If U.S. Figure Skating wants new requirements for skaters reporting injuries, especially for major international events, fine. But it should be a process with input from all involved, including athletes. Not this way, making a negative example out of a skater with a reputation as solid as Flatt has. Yes, there is an agreement that athletes sign about reporting injuries. But most skaters deal with some sort of pain all the time, and it wasn't as though Flatt was incapacitated. She still was able to compete and do her programs."

The requirement is not new. And "some sort of pain" is not usually a stress fracture of the leg. And I would argue that she WAS incapacitated to the point she was NOT able to do her programs as they had been laid out.

I am not one of those who wants to crucify Flatt but this article has a definite pro-Rachael slant that is inaccurate as those blasting her.

Well put.

I have no patience for an obviously biased (imo) reporter from Colorado anyway. I almost brought my tissues out as I read on. :violin:


It isn't an article. It is a column, and hence an opinion piece, not a news story.

Thanks for clarifying for all.

Ok. It's an obviously imo biased opinion piece. :rolleyes:

Sasha'sSpins
06-24-2011, 07:24 PM
Frankly (and no offense to these ladies), I HOPE that's the case.

I want to see some new faces on the scene.

Frankly, saying you HOPE that's the case IS offensive. I personally hope at least one of the old guard makes it-I know from my experiece with each Olympic cycle that it is unlikely all the top three performers today will likely make the team by Sochi. But I hope at least one or two do.

And if that spites those who seem dismissive of their talent and want new faces on the scene-so be it.

TheIronLady
06-24-2011, 08:01 PM
Ok. It's an obviously imo biased opinion piece. :rolleyes:

I don't think we needed your opinion to know that. How can an opinion piece be unbiased?

The Fly On The Wall
06-24-2011, 08:11 PM
Amazing that a skater who everyone finds so "flat" and "boring" has inspired a 31-page thread. :shuffle: I hope Rachael never, ever reads here.

TheIronLady
06-24-2011, 08:29 PM
Amazing that a skater who everyone finds so "flat" and "boring" has inspired a 31-page thread. :shuffle: I hope Rachael never, ever reads here.

She's a tough cookie. She would not let it affect her negatively.

And this isn't just wishful thinking to encourage this thread to go on... ;)