PDA

View Full Version : Javier Fernández left Morozov to train with Orser



Pages : 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 [12] 13

AragornElessar
10-31-2011, 02:16 AM
Actually, Javi's been noticed for a few years now, but in the "If he could get to the right person who could tap into his potential, then LOOK OUT!!" kind of way. Morozov was not that coach, and sadly, he's stagnating as a Choreographer IMO. When you don't need to be told the program's been choreographed by him, but by the over the top amount of posing and toe pick-y footwork when you watch a skater/team skate the program, that's not a good thing.

As for the posts here about how Javi didn't have the performance in the FS like in the SP, well for crying out loud of course he didn't. He's never been in the position of not only having to be the final skater of the night at a GP event he competed at before, *but* also having to skate after Patrick *and* Dai. Two World Champions, one of them on home ice, w/two huge fan bases there in the arena and he ended up having to skate after the two of them?

No wonder he seemed a bit nervous. Even Brian said he was glad Javi had the "buffer" of Dai inbetween Patrick and Javi, because even he would have been terrified having to skate after Patrick the other night due to the possible crowd reaction. Regardless of all of that, I thought Javi did outstandingly well considering all of this is a new experience for him.

Now that Javi's had that, he can bank it and have somewhat of an idea of what to expect for the next time he's leading after the SP. Regardless of who else is in the field and where the event is.

I'm just so happy for Javi that it's looking like he's *finally* beginning to take the next step up in his skating and also reach that potential I saw close to four or five years ago during CBC Bold's Worlds coverage. I can't wait to see how the rest of the Season goes for him. :)

Vagabond
10-31-2011, 02:31 AM
Since this is, on some level, a Morozov thread, I will cross-post what I posted in the French skating thread:


Florent Amodio posted this on his Facebook page (http://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=10150337663531143&id=302080336142) Friday evening and also had it on his Twitter feed (http://twitter.com/#!/florentamodio):


Florent va retrouver ses marques et son amour du patinage aux sources aupres de son club de Cergy qui est toujours là, avec son coach Bernard et toute l'équipe, quand il sera en France...en coopération avec son coach Nikolai ,bien realiste dans ce monde difficile!! (on dira comme ça!) qui l'attend à Moscow...A nous le travail...

The gist of it is that he wants to get back his old (high) marks and his love of skating by spending some time with Bernard Glesser and his team in Cergy, while continuing to work with Morozov.

It looks like he posted that before Javier Fernández's Short Program at Skate Canada. I wonder how he feels now. :shuffle:

I would love to know what Morozov and Amodio have to say to each other at this point, given that the latter has now said in a very public forum that he's lost his love for skating.

nana7045
10-31-2011, 02:43 AM
I think people are unfair to Morozov. I found the last year's Fernandez was very well packaged for "up-and-coming" skater who wants to get noticed. Clearly that mission was accomplished and a lot of this season early success should be credited to that ground work.


I agree with you.

I'm happy that Javier got medal at SC and has good relationship with Orser.
Just I cannot understand why people blames Morosov so much.

Under Morosov, Javier had improved his technique greatly (3-3, 3A, 4T, 4S and of course step).
If Morosov did nothing for him, why can he do two quads now?
Javier's technique is clearly based on Morosov's coaching.

Morosov taught a lot to Javier, now he goes to next step.
I think we don't have to deny what he learned from Morozov.

(Miki became the World Champion two times with Morozov, but I don't deny what she learned from her former coach Nobuo Sato and Jenkins.:))

Hope Javier will have a good season:D

dinakt
10-31-2011, 03:32 AM
SP is great but what is the FS about? Is it a parody of a classical program (like Bradley's FS)? Is it a classical program? Because it doesn't really look like either. I don't get the concept, I don't think it gels together particularly well.

But my expectations were sky high after the extraordinary SP and he did seem very tense during the FS. It's surely gonna look better with more mileage.



No, what I think happened is that he skated an unbelievably amazing, incredible SP. Not just because of the jumps but had great speed, tons of expression, fantastic projection. He just really exceeded himself and delivered the performance of his life.

And the judges went along with it.

The FS was disappointing to me, he seemed very tense and wooden in his upper body, but when you have already made such a killer impression and are skating last, having beaten two World Champions, you are going to get high marks.

I think the floodgates are opened now. With the marks he earned, having got the silver medal and almost beaten Chan, the cred is earned and his marks are going to be much higher now.

I hope Javier's cred is earned. His PCS had been stagnating for the last few years, and between Brian addressing them and Javi getting his first GP medal, they should improve.
As for the LP- I love it, and I don't see any parody in it at all. I don't think it's particularly programmatic, but the bulk of the music is taken from various arias of the Duke- a charming young rogue who never gets his commeuppance while more virtuous characters get destroyed. The LP consists of the part of the Overture, then 3 arias of the Duke ( all in different character, while remaining amorous- roguish, seductive, determined), and the LP ends with the music from the great storm scene, where the main events take place (and the Duke emerges unharmed). So I like to imagine Fernandez is portraying the Duke, albeit very loosely. More change in body language when the musical parts are changing would be welcome to me, but not necessary.

Ziggy
10-31-2011, 09:48 AM
As for the LP- I love it, and I don't see any parody in it at all.
...
So I like to imagine Fernandez is portraying the Duke, albeit very loosely. More change in body language when the musical parts are changing would be welcome to me, but not necessary.

But his body movement is neither serious and regal, nor light and humorous. It's something halfway in between and I just don't see where Wilson was trying to get at, at all.

Another thing is what you have mentioned. There's different pieces of music with different tempo and intensity and I don't feel that he's reflecting the changes in the music well.

Hedwig
10-31-2011, 10:08 AM
IUnder Morosov, Javier had improved his technique greatly (3-3, 3A, 4T, 4S and of course step).
If Morosov did nothing for him, why can he do two quads now?
Javier's technique is clearly based on Morosov's coaching.

Morosov taught a lot to Javier, now he goes to next step.
I think we don't have to deny what he learned from Morozov.

Javi definitely learned something under Morosov. But the jump technique was there before Morosov. He landed his first triple axel in competition when he was a tiny 15 year old.
He was doing quads before going to Morosov.

I agree with Ziggy about the FS. I had the same kind of issues with some of Yu-Na's classical programs. Her Fledermaus I never bought into because I was never sure if she meant it with humour or not.
But I loved the SP and his general attack. He was intimadet by placing 1st after the short but not really that much. He was not in dead shock like for instance Mirai Nagasu is when she places 1st after the short.

allezfred
10-31-2011, 10:38 AM
Fernandez has always had the skills. It just needed the right packaging and polish which he hasn't had up till now. I also think he needed more personal attention which he didn't seem to be getting with Morosov (I remember overhearing him at 2010 Euros complaining that he had wanted Morosov to be there, but Morosov had declined his request to come).

Proustable
11-01-2011, 01:54 AM
That's something he's said in interviews as well, though a little more diplomatically.

dinakt
11-01-2011, 04:34 AM
But his body movement is neither serious and regal, nor light and humorous. It's something halfway in between and I just don't see where Wilson was trying to get at, at all.

Another thing is what you have mentioned. There's different pieces of music with different tempo and intensity and I don't feel that he's reflecting the changes in the music well.

I'll bait and disagree:)
Not that I don't think more changes of mood and posture and, very importantly, speed, will not make the program better. But as I see it, it is choreographed very well and quite specifically.
Part 1- Intro- Opening/jump section, like a Prologue, broad jestures, jumps, good speed; not a particular character but rather an "Introduction to Drama"; a "serious" part.
Part 2 - " La Donna e Mobile"- change of character (to Duke himself), it becomes playful, cocky, smaller intricate steps, twizzles. Here's the flirting Duke. When Javi turns on his million- dollar charm there, it'll become clearer. Because he's got it.
Part 3 - "Bella Figlia dell'Amore"- change of mood again, lyrical, "seductive" part, back to broad arm jestures though less speed than the Opening. Duke in love. Broad, almost balletic.
Part 4- "Possente Amor Mi Chiama"- theoretically, a Duke determined to retrieve his abducted love. Here we have a series of spins, which, while not literal ( of course), can convey a determination. Now, if they were faster ( much faster), it would be much better, but we are in October.
Part 5- final steps to the "Storm" music- the steps speed up, sense of doom and drama, stepping from the character to the narrator, like in the beginning. The end.
Again, I am not saying Javi differentiates between the parts enough, or finishes all his movements enough to make the intention clear. All I am saying that all those sections are reflected in choreography and closely correspond to the opera's characterization. I think with this choreo Javier CAN make it Grand-Scale- Operatic- Interesting- Program. It's in there. Whether he will or not, I have no idea. It's complicated theatrically and he needs to be relaxed enough to act. For now I just see that his choreo is better than ever, he jumps well, looks lovely, seems to go in a right direction- and I am happy.

Ziggy
11-01-2011, 08:35 AM
Thanks, that's an interesting analysis. :)

As you said yourself, it's October and it was the first time Javi was in a situation like this. So obviously, for now he can be given benefit of doubt. Hopefully that program will improve with more mileage.

Even if he simply skates it while being more relaxed and turning up the charm factor, it's going to look much better.

immoimeme
11-01-2011, 09:21 PM
First off, I am JUST THRILLED for Javi's results at Skate Canada, whee!!!!! :respec: :rockstar:
This coaching change is exactly what was needed and I feel that by Worlds the free program will have completely gelled (the short one already has ) :)

Cherub721
11-01-2011, 09:53 PM
dinakt, I'm going to save your post and re-read it after Javi's performance at Euros. :) I bet it will be amazing by then.

paskatefan
11-02-2011, 10:55 AM
First off, I am JUST THRILLED for Javi's results at Skate Canada, whee!!!!! :respec: :rockstar:
This coaching change is exactly what was needed and I feel that by Worlds the free program will have completely gelled (the short one already has ) :)


My thoughts exactly! I am "over the moon" for his performances @ SC! :encore:

dots
11-02-2011, 11:39 AM
I hope Javier ends up winning Euros. What a delighful skater he is. :swoon:

Andrey aka Pushkin
11-02-2011, 12:00 PM
I/K next? :sekret: