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View Full Version : Flatt hurt for Worlds but skates anyways !



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JamieElena
06-15-2011, 10:08 PM
Flatt will be fined by USFSA, see latest from P. Hersch here: http://trib.in/mUIoF1

julieann
06-15-2011, 10:14 PM
Flatt will be fined by USFSA, see latest from P. Hersch here: http://trib.in/mUIoF1


"Mirai is in great shape - better than she has been her whole life," Carroll said a week after worlds. "She took the responsibility of being ready as the alternate very seriously."

Interesting quote on so many levels.

Imperfect Edge
06-15-2011, 11:27 PM
Tbh unless you seriously thought you were going to get called up upon how prepared would Mirai really have been? Walden/Edwards who placed 20th (I think) or rather their supporters were very quick to jump in and say they weren't as ready as they could have been.

Frank is arguing that Mirai was pretty prepared. Also worth considering whether if she had declared her injury would she have been pulled from the team? Because she/her team clearly didn't see it as preventing her from competing.

But 'fine unprecedented' it would be inappropriate I would say for a massive fine when these skaters are amateurs and aren't allowed to earn much at all. I do think punishment of some sort is just but I'm not sure a massive fine is appropriate.

TheIronLady
06-15-2011, 11:28 PM
Flatt will be fined by USFSA, see latest from P. Hersch here: http://trib.in/mUIoF1

How embarrassing for her, but there are consequences for not thinking these things through.

I hope the USFSA also takes some responsibility by looking at the judging at Nationals that put Rachael on the team in the first place. Rachael's free program at Nationals had some overall deficiencies. Her components marks at Nationals were out of line with what she had received internationally. USFSA judges should try to reflect international standards and cultural preferences in the components if they want to help choose the most competitive World teams.

Sylvia
06-15-2011, 11:29 PM
FYI, the discussion about Hersh's follow-up article and USFS' action is taking place in this new thread: http://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/showthread.php?t=79180

RD
06-15-2011, 11:57 PM
I hope the USFSA also takes some responsibility by looking at the judging at Nationals that put Rachael on the team in the first place. Rachael's free program at Nationals had some overall deficiencies. Her components marks at Nationals were out of line with what she had received internationally. USFSA judges should try to reflect international standards and cultural preferences in the components if they want to help choose the most competitive World teams.

Overall I still think Flatt had the edge over Nagasu at Nationals. It's unfortunate things played out the way they did, but the World team was right.

ProgramerUSFS
06-16-2011, 12:07 AM
Since I started this thread, I will leave one last comment and then think all should change to the thread Sylvia pointed out.

I must say, I am really impressed at USFS to take this action. As I have said before, Flatt took there money for training, and therefore had a responsibility to report and be transparent to who you represent. Now, Tom I hope is also fined, based on the fact that he got this money from Flatt for training her. But he is at the center of responsibility because he is her advisor and both are members in good standing with the association. I truly hope that he as well is fined, which will send a message to all who represent the US in competitions that you work together as a team.

As for the judges, well they know what they did. I think things are going to be different now, and hope that we all pointed out things that needed to be addressed.

AxelAnnie
06-16-2011, 12:38 AM
Well, glory be! Good for USFSA!

And given the on / off state of Worlds, I would think ALL the athletes were doing their best to be in shape, especially Nagasu.......being the alternate to Worlds, and then not being prepared...........I don't think her career or reputation would ever have recovered.

FSWer
06-16-2011, 02:32 AM
I don't have to read through this whole thread to even say that....GEEZ!!!! All the Girl did was get hurt and was a brave Skater to still keep skating. It was in fact (from what I understand,the skater has the final say to if they want to skate or send in an alternate) after all....her final desision to if she wanted to skate.....FINING?!!! That is the most...STUPIDIST,DUMBEST,ROTTENEST,IDEA they have ever had!!!!!! I also say that. Because the Girl is recoving. She doesn't need to deal with that.

Clarice
06-16-2011, 02:52 AM
It's more complicated than that, FSWer.
Rachael isn't being fined because she got hurt. Skaters get hurt all the time. (Although if the injury is as bad as Rachael's was, the skater really shouldn't be skating, because they might make the injury even worse. That's one reason people are upset with Rachael's coach, for letting her skate anyway.)
The problem is that Rachael was hurt badly enough that she couldn't do a good job. When that happens, she and her coach should have told USFS so that the alternate could have gone to the competition instead. They should have told USFS the truth, and they didn't. That's why USFS is fining Rachael. Now we're waiting to see what they'll do with her coach.
I know Rachael is a favorite of yours, but in this case she and her coach made a bad decision.

FSWer
06-17-2011, 02:17 AM
I agree you shouldn't skate if your hurt badly. But #1...if the COACH let her skate. Why are they fining Rachael? # 2 if it doesn't say ANYTHING in the rulebook about who has the final say. Then if it IS true a Skater CAN decide themselves (and just use common sense) to if they think they can skate. It would be SMART for them to decide not to skate. But even if the skater knows they are hurt or might not do 100%. The SKATER should still be able to deside without questions from a Federation. That's part of Sports. For ex. a Football Player wouldn't be find if he got hurt. But the coach decided to still let him play. Also,telling a skater what they should have done,and MAKING THEM send in the auternate is like saying the Federation doesn't care if they forfill their Goal/Dream (in this case the chance at Worlds).

agalisgv
06-17-2011, 03:51 AM
The rules say both the skater and the coach MUST notify USFSA if there is an injury that could affect a skater's performance. Rachel personally signed-off on those rules, but then didn't notify USFSA when she was injured. She's being fined for violating that rule.

AndyWarhol
06-17-2011, 04:25 AM
There really should be somewhere in the rule book that states you might get fined for breaking rules. It is clear they are making an example of her.

Triple Butz
06-17-2011, 04:30 AM
I agree you shouldn't skate if your hurt badly. But #1...if the COACH let her skate. Why are they fining Rachael? # 2 if it doesn't say ANYTHING in the rulebook about who has the final say. Then if it IS true a Skater CAN decide themselves (and just use common sense) to if they think they can skate. It would be SMART for them to decide not to skate. But even if the skater knows they are hurt or might not do 100%. The SKATER should still be able to deside without questions from a Federation. That's part of Sports. For ex. a Football Player wouldn't be find if he got hurt. But the coach decided to still let him play. Also,telling a skater what they should have done,and MAKING THEM send in the auternate is like saying the Federation doesn't care if they forfill their Goal/Dream (in this case the chance at Worlds).

Rachael is an adult. In the sports you mentioned, individual players are fined/suspended all the time for breaking the rules. And it's "you're" not "your."

FSWer
06-17-2011, 04:45 AM
The rules say both the skater and the coach MUST notify USFSA if there is an injury that could affect a skater's performance. Rachel personally signed-off on those rules, but then didn't notify USFSA when she was injured. She's being fined for violating that rule.

Ok,after a Skater notifies the Federation. Does the Federation then leave it up to the Skater to deside if they DO feel ok enough to skate,and if they THEMSELVES want to send in the Alternate? Or does the Federation say that the skater has to? Because there is a big difference if you think about it. Also,did she herself deside not to report? Or did the coach tell her not to?What does that mean sign off?