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matti
03-19-2011, 03:46 PM
This thread is about the speed skating legend Karin Enke (aka Karin Kania, Karin Enke-Kania, Karin Kania-Enke, Karin Enke-Busch, Karin Busch-Enke, Karin Enke-Richter, Karin Richter-Enke...:p)?

She was originally a figure skater - 9th at the 1977 Europeans. Has anyone seen any footage of her skating? Even pics? Did she grow too tall? Was she in the Jutta Müller stables?

Taso
03-20-2011, 01:09 PM
I have never seen her figure skated - I'd love to! Here is an article from the Calgary Olympics about Karin's background! It doesn't mention where she trained, except that she was from Dresden and that she switched to speed skating because of the puberty monster (she's 5'10).

http://articles.latimes.com/1988-02-11/sports/sp-42303_1_karin-enke-kania

floskate
03-20-2011, 01:50 PM
Here's a picture of her at the SC Einheit in Dresden where she trained out of. She's on the far left next to her coach who I should know the name of, other than her surname which is Lehmann.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/26/Bundesarchiv_Bild_183-M1220-0032%2C_K._Enke%2C_Lehmann%2C_H._Schulz%2C_C._Gris chke%2C_K._Zobel.jpg

essence_of_soy
03-21-2011, 12:42 AM
New Zealand's Allie Rout has apparently changed to speed skating as well. We may see her in Sochi after all.

essence_of_soy
03-21-2011, 12:49 AM
Here's a picture of her at the SC Einheit in Dresden where she trained out of. She's on the far left next to her coach who I should know the name of, other than her surname which is Lehmann.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/26/Bundesarchiv_Bild_183-M1220-0032%2C_K._Enke%2C_Lehmann%2C_H._Schulz%2C_C._Gris chke%2C_K._Zobel.jpg

Is the guy in the middle a young Michael Huth?

Actually, looking at the date, Mike would have been five when this picture was taken.

matti
03-21-2011, 09:15 AM
I have never seen her figure skated - I'd love to! Here is an article from the Calgary Olympics about Karin's background! It doesn't mention where she trained, except that she was from Dresden and that she switched to speed skating because of the puberty monster (she's 5'10).

http://articles.latimes.com/1988-02-11/sports/sp-42303_1_karin-enke-kania

Thanks! So she was still a figure skater in 1979 and less than a year later she won an Olympic gold medal in speed skating!?! Amazing. Speed skating is closer than I thought to figure skating... :eek:

matti
03-21-2011, 09:19 AM
Here's a picture of her at the SC Einheit in Dresden where she trained out of. She's on the far left next to her coach who I should know the name of, other than her surname which is Lehmann.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/26/Bundesarchiv_Bild_183-M1220-0032%2C_K._Enke%2C_Lehmann%2C_H._Schulz%2C_C._Gris chke%2C_K._Zobel.jpg

Thanks! I thought the girl on the far left was Laura Lepistö...:P

She must have been pretty strong, already attempting multiple triple jumps (just guessing)?

gkelly
03-21-2011, 12:28 PM
She must have been pretty strong, already attempting multiple triple jumps (just guessing)?

I have no idea about this particular skater.

Ca. 1979-1980, the very best jumpers in the senior ladies ranks may have been attempting three different triple jumps, good jumpers one or two, and many lower-ranked seniors nothing harder than double axel (with even that possibly iffy).

In their programs. They may have been attempting more in practice.

I don't have enough data to go by, but in that generation I'd expect juniors to be working on comparable content, aiming to match or outdo the current seniors by the time they got to seniors themselves. Of course, not all would succeed, or get there at all.

floskate
03-21-2011, 07:09 PM
.....
I don't have enough data to go by, but in that generation I'd expect juniors to be working on comparable content, aiming to match or outdo the current seniors by the time they got to seniors themselves. Of course, not all would succeed, or get there at all.

I'd say that's right. Obviously exceptional juniors such as Zayak (1979 world junior champ) were waaaay ahead and Ito - despite finishing only 8th at 1981 Junior worlds (held in London, Ontario in December of 1980) landed 5 triple jumps in her LP. A year later she was up to 6 triple freeskates with flip and lutz but these really were the exceptions to the rule. Looking at footage from those 81 Junior Worlds and the same comp in late 1983 in Sapporo, the girls were struggling just to get triple sal and/or toe done, although I think by 1980 ladies had progressed to the point that a good double lutz and a horribly cheated double axel just wasn't going to cut it.

Vagabond
03-21-2011, 08:00 PM
I couldn't find any videos from the Ladies' Free Skate at Euros 1977. However, here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6WC6oy_2vyA) is the Worlds 1977 Free Skate of Barbara Smith, who finished fourth overall behind Linda Fratianne, Anett Pötzsch, and Dagmar Lurz. She did two triple salchows (one of which was planned as part of a 3S-2A sequence), and a double axel (with a fall out). At U.S. Nationals in 1976, she became the first American woman to land two triple jumps (salchow and toe loop) in the same program.

Linda Fratianne (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VfXwK-5erYE), who was ill during Worlds in 1977, fell on her triple salchow but landed a triple toe loop and a couple of double axels, one of which was in combination.

Karin Enke wasn't even the East German champion in 1977. I would be surprised if she even attempted any triple jumps at Euros.

matti
03-22-2011, 07:41 PM
Thank you all for your input! :) Well, she was a new generation of DDR skaters, so I'm sure she and her trainers eagerly tried to outdo her idols and rivals (like gkelly said). East Germans were very much in the vanguard of technical side (=jumping...) of the sport. Seyfert, Morgenstern; Jan Hoffmann was only the second man to land a triple lutz in competition (after a hiatus of twelve years) etc.

Obviously she was hugely talented and a hard worker, but was her talent only in speed skating...

orbitz
03-22-2011, 08:51 PM
I couldn't find any videos from the Ladies' Free Skate at Euros 1977. However, here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6WC6oy_2vyA) is the Worlds 1977 Free Skate of Barbara Smith, who finished fourth overall behind Linda Fratianne, Anett Pötzsch, and Dagmar Lurz. She did two triple salchows (one of which was planned as part of a 3S-2A sequence), and a double axel (with a fall out). At U.S. Nationals in 1976, she became the first American woman to land two triple jumps (salchow and toe loop) in the same program.


Linda Fratianne is given the credit as the first woman to perform two different triples within a LP. Was it Smith or was it Fratianne? If Smith could do two triples during the same era that Fratianne was competing then why didn't she hang around to give Linda a run for the titles?

Vagabond
03-22-2011, 10:24 PM
Linda Fratianne is given the credit as the first woman to perform two different triples within a LP. Was it Smith or was it Fratianne?

I was going by the information on the Youtube page for this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VLX9vadrPdg) audio of ABC's coverage of Smith's FS at Nationals in 1976. Dick Button clearly calls both a triple salchow and at least one triple toe loop. It sounds as if she may have done a 3T+3T sequence or even a combination. Fratianne also did do two different jumps in her FS at 1976 Nationals (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a6gKsPBeoY0). Who skated first in the Free Skate, Fratianne or Smith? Did either of them do two different triples at some previous competition such as Sectionals?

However, the Smith-vs.-Fratianne discussion may be moot. There's a comment on the Youtube page for the Smith audio that says that Melissa Militano did three different triple jumps (toe loop, salchow, and loop) in her FS at U.S. Nationals in 1972. :eek:


If Smith could do two triples during the same era that Fratianne was competing then why didn't she hang around to give Linda a run for the titles?

According to the comments on the Youtube page to which I linked in this post, she suffered some injuries and developed an ulcer. It also appears from the comments that she may now be suffering from multiple sclerosis. :(

Dick Button's comments on Smith's skating are fascinating. He even calls her perhaps the best female free skater there had been to that time (which would put her above Fleming, Lynn, Hammill, and Fratianne). :respec:

floskate
03-22-2011, 10:47 PM
Ah I love that Barbie Smith LP so much. I do wish we had more footage of her as she clearly was an extra ordinary skater. Such power and flow in her edges and that 2nd triple sal is just beautiful. I have heard from those who saw it that Melissa Militano did indeed do three different triple jumps in her LP at the 1972 Nationals. I think it must exist in the Howard Craker films of Nationals at the World Skating museum. She also did triple jumps in her pairs routines. In 1975 at Worlds with her partner Johnny Johns she attempted a throw double axel stepping directly into a triple toe walley on her own. Johns, who was also an ice dancer only had up to double flip in jumps I believe, so at the time it was a way of bumping their technical content. Militano and Johns also had a huuuge triple twist and a throw triple loop.