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casken
05-18-2011, 03:08 AM
What they said about the programs not being ready and using the same lifts for three season was absolutely right. Even at worlds their programs looked unfinished.

And they are right when saying they aren't essentially any inferior to the Shibs, it's just the Shibs clearly have a superior training regime. I'm a critic of Shpilband/Zueva, but their teams can twizzle and lift better and more consistently than any other teams in the world and that gets them huge TES.

millipied
05-18-2011, 03:12 AM
No, it's not being realistic, his quote was:



Wasn't Zhulin their coach while they won their world juniors title? I didn't hear any complaints after that win...were there any until this year? Didn't they get their seasons best just a few months ago under him.

So what, they beat the Shibs in juniors, this is the seniors and every single competitions is different. Did Yuna expect because she beat everyone in juniors that she was unbeatable? I hope not.

If they didn't get along with him, or didn't like his training method, that's one thing, move on; now they have to chance to prove how good they can be with Morozov. But what will he say when the Shibs beat him next year? Who will he blame? :watch:

And what will he say when they beat them? I don't get your point. The guy is upset at losing to the main competition, not D/W or V/M or B/S.Just because he used word Juniors does not mean he compares seniors to juniors here. In fact, I believe they beat S/S at senior level as well. He believes he is better than S/S. He identified the problems and this is his attempt to solve them.

Mayra
05-18-2011, 03:19 AM
Both Zhulin and Katsapalov made valid comments regarding issues and training methods, but it's obvious I/K wanted something more from their training that Zhulin wasn't willing to give. If that's the case, then it is probably best for the students to move on.

Not surprised the loss to the Shibutani's was brought up. The RF could not have been happy with that result, especially because I/K soundly beat them as juniors, and as many here have stated repeatedly, I/K are considered the more talented pair. I don't think that is a slam against the Shibs, just commentary on where they stood and where they stand now.

I imagine they were nailed to the wall by their federation who whispered in their ear, you are the more talented pair, you beat this team last year....What happened? Did you not work hard enough? I/K obviously consider themselves hard workers and willing to put in the work, so it must have been the trainer at fault who didn't prepare them right? Having your doubts confirmed and maybe a little fuel added to the fire, no doubt helped push I/K to finally make the split.

I hope the switch works out for them and that they come up with some :kickass: programs.

Proustable
05-18-2011, 03:24 AM
And what will he say when they beat them? I don't get your point. The guy is upset at losing to the main competition, not D/W or V/M or B/S.Just because he used word Juniors does not mean he compares seniors to juniors here. In fact, I believe they beat S/S at senior level as well. He believes he is better than S/S. He identified the problems and this is his attempt to solve them.

When did they beat the Shibs at the senior level? The Shibs beat them at NHK and Worlds. I/K weren't at Nebelhorn, SA, or 4CC (the three other international competitions the Shibs attended).

bek
05-18-2011, 03:27 AM
No, it's not being realistic, his quote was:



Wasn't Zhulin their coach while they won their world juniors title? I didn't hear any complaints after that win...were there any until this year? Didn't they get their seasons best just a few months ago under him.

So what, they beat the Shibs in juniors, this is the seniors and every single competitions is different. Did Yuna expect because she beat everyone in juniors that she was unbeatable? I hope not.

If they didn't get along with him, or didn't like his training method, that's one thing, move on; now they have to chance to prove how good they can be with Morozov. But what will he say when the Shibs beat him next year? Who will he blame? :watch:


Maybe the Shibs will beat them next year maybe they won't. But I think if you were losing to a team you were beating repeatedly a year before, that you SHOULD be asking some serious questions. I find the whole Zhulin is perfect for them to be a bit huh? Because they HAVE had recycled lifts. They have been inconsistent this season. These are facts. And its perfectly a good thing for them to be asking questions.

caseyedwards
05-18-2011, 03:31 AM
When did they beat the Shibs at the senior level? The Shibs beat them at NHK and Worlds. I/K weren't at Nebelhorn, SA, or 4CC (the three other international competitions the Shibs attended).

I thought of the SP at NHK but that was really because of a wardrobe malfunction on the part of S/S.

Cloudy_Gumdrops
05-18-2011, 03:46 AM
I hope the switch works out for them and that they come up with some :kickass: programs.

I hope the switch works out too.

As for :kickass: programs? Well, let's hope they decide to utilize outside choreographers. Morozov's choreo may score well (as evidenced by V&T), but it's too generic for them.

fanof
05-18-2011, 05:43 AM
I love Navka/Morozov dance team in 1998 :D . Go Morozov and I/K :D

fanof
05-18-2011, 05:51 AM
I thought of the SP at NHK but that was really because of a wardrobe malfunction on the part of S/S.

But Many of all times I/K lost to Shibutanis is becuse I/K does so much misstakes in the program (little lift, twizzle lifts) that is minor but add up: (World FS). This is why. Shibutanis only skate in one spot useing striaght legs in both the feet. The Ugly leg feet .

I/K is a talent for skating and dancing. Not close to Yana dances :D:D but a big talent. :D I love them:D

julieann
05-18-2011, 05:58 AM
IIRC I/K and S/S only met twice in competition in 09-10; the GPF where I/K beat S/S by 0.61 points :rolleyes: hardly a steamrolling. The other time was at Jr. Worlds where I/K won all three competitions 1-1-1 to win and S/S were 2-4-4 to end up in 4th overall; behind I/K by about 20 points. Not the Shibs best competition, far from it. So again....for him to say because he beat them by less than a point and a killing another time does not mean S/S will not come out ahead at another competition.

I understand his point that they both seemed pretty equally talented and should have progressed at the same level, but it doesn't work that way, it never has in any discipline. Mukhortova and Trankov won Jr. Worlds in 2005 over Dube and Davison, does that mean D/D will never improve beyond M/T? Obviously not, D/D won a World Sr. bronze medal and M/T were in 7th, but did you hear M/T complaining? (that was a rhetorical question :scream: )

I understand he was very frustrated with happened, it sounds just awful. But if they were unhappy before the test skates last year, he certainly didn't voice his discontent back then, at least not on the internet. Now he'll have to wait to see what Morozov does for them. I'm sure Zhulin will have a rebuttal, no coach likes to be called out.

Either way, they are away from the man they thought was holding them back and I hope they get the results they are looking for. They are still very young.

zotza
05-18-2011, 12:35 PM
The point is that they always seem to blame the others.First they blame the fans for shouting and making them lose concentration at Worlds.Then, the coach is to blame for not giving them new lifts while Nikita himself did the same mistake twice in the same lift at two major competitions.I wouldn't give them new lifts if they still risked killing themselves with their old ones..
Yes, theoretically speaking ,they could finish ahead of the Shibs.But they had three teams between the two of them, and they were 10 in the FD?I don't know if Zhulin and people around them tell them they're the best thing since peanut butter but it's another thing to have a winner's attitude and another to constantly contradict yourself.It would be much better if they worked,without talking, and then get the results they think they deserve.

Another thing that makes me mad is what the RSF is supposedly doing.If they have traded the coach with the 1st couple positing before the season even starts, there is no need for the other couples to even try to compete.If you award positions and medals behind the scenes how are you going to look professional?It's like saying that Skate Canada had to prevent W/P from finishing above C/P and send the judges a note saying,"don't you dare give them better marks".For this reason only,I refuse to believe that there is such a case, yet.

MarieM
05-18-2011, 12:38 PM
Wow. Like ALL students arriving at dear NM camp, they begin trashing the old coach... Pffff it's getting boring with Morozov really.

From what P&B always said, Zhulin wasn't there all the time, but the assistant coaches WERE. Oleg and the others. So Nikita is telling bullshit as far as I'm concerned.
RSF and FFSG just act the same. Sad sad sad.

RumbleFish
05-18-2011, 12:45 PM
I'm really disappointed with I/K, especially with Katsalapov's mouth. They weren't good enough to have a prayer against Shibs at worlds, and pointing fingers at their former coach won't get their skating any better.

Last thing I want to see next season is them getting on the podium with e-coli morozov TM rubish program with lots of posing and two foot skating.

Coco
05-18-2011, 01:13 PM
Seriously, when there is always someone or something to blame, there always WILL be someone or something to blame, you know?

quiqie
05-18-2011, 01:40 PM
From what P&B always said, Zhulin wasn't there all the time, but the assistant coaches WERE. Oleg and the others.

Nikita says as much:
Of course, the second coach, Oleg Volkov, was there when Zhulin was absent