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let`s talk
12-21-2010, 01:05 PM
Then again there's always the one about the younger generation should be seen and not heard. Works online really well.

My simple axiom confirmed.

let`s talk
12-21-2010, 01:16 PM
In days past, the younger generation learned proper decorum and behavior (human social skills) at the feet of the older generation. Didn't matter if you were a relative or not - the whole village was involved. We've gotten so far removed from that, and it shows in some people's posts here.

We can go back to feudalism, then it was even stricter. Nowdays your success mainly depends on your skills, partly this is the result of capitalism and the Internet enterprises. The age doesn't count that much as it used to. Many young people become successful at younger age than it was decades or centuries ago. Democracy itself is supposed to put people on equal level, regardless of age, gender, race and nationality. The fact that the younger generation sees themselves as equal is a direct result of the global social tendencies. I don't see any problems with that. If some older people have difficulties with the younger generation, in 99.9% of cases they remind you of their older age just because they don't have anything else to be proud of. Those older people who got successful in the life, don't need to do that. As the result they are usually the most valuable advisers and I respect them for that.

beepbeep
12-21-2010, 01:31 PM
My levels of tolerance towards screming jumping kids in the upstairs apartment at 11:30 pm, the neighbour's dogs that will bark all night, my downstairs' neighbour so called singing are incredibly low. I'll start complaining as soon as it starts, and it escalates as the day goes on.

And I'm just 30... :slinkaway

Twilight1
12-21-2010, 01:32 PM
I don't think it is jealousy of older people on the younger generation just for simply being older. That is an easy out to justify entitlement some kids/ young adults have. I think the isolative lifestyle people have has more to do with it. My generation was the one that starting staying inside playing video games as opposed to playing outside. My generation also started conversing online as opposed to getting together for coffee. With technological advancement came the unique issue of not really learning social skills.

I remember friends complaining to me that they had to visit their grandparents on Sunday instead of being able to play their Coleco Vision or Atari (I know really aging myself :lol:) I think this could contribute to some of the issues we see.

That combined with both parents having to work and not being able to instill these vital skills to live in society. Also, grandparents have to step back into the parental role because child care is so expensive. I could see some grandparents (despite loving their grandkids a bunch) being a bit resentful of having to care for their grandkids...they already raised their kids....

It could be a whole slew of reasons why it appears the older generations are a bit more crusty/ grouchy.

sk8pics
12-21-2010, 01:35 PM
This is all very interesting. My aunt is 78 and in some ways she is grumpier than she used to be. She complains about my cousins and her sister-in-law a lot, but I have been slowly training her not to do so much of that to me. She lives alone and although she has a lot of friends and is pretty active I still think she is somewhat isolated. Definitely set in her ways and that causes her to be grumpy at times at family gatherings. I have a friend who is 71 and feels and looks more like 50, and he has mellowed a bit more in his old age. He told me the older he gets the freer he feels to say what he thinks. Fortunately he is a very good person and very good-natured so it's not like he goes around bitching at people. :lol: I've been spending a lot of time with him lately and it is really so nice.

I'm 52 and I noticed I have less tolerance for crap at work. I had noticed that eventually most people at work reach a point of being very jaded and bitter and I am trying hard not to do that. But... like I said, I have become less tolerant of stuff there. In the rest of my life I have mellowed quite a bit, though! I have to say I'm a lot happier than I used to be, and I sometimes think how it can waste so much time in your life if you are unhappy. Not that you can always do something about it, but sometimes you can.

Bailey_
12-21-2010, 02:03 PM
There is a feeling amongst some of those who I work with and have been working for many years, that those in the 20s have an incredible sense of self-entitlement and expectation which far exceeds what they actually deserve.

This could probably be a whole new topic.

ITA - we have seen a real change in some of the students that we supervise for university placements. Entitlement does not begin to explain some of their behavior and it makes me feel like a cranky old person - when I'm not!

PDilemma
12-21-2010, 02:06 PM
There is a feeling amongst some of those who I work with and have been working for many years, that those in the 20s have an incredible sense of self-entitlement and expectation which far exceeds what they actually deserve.

This could probably be a whole new topic.

Having taught them, I would say that about half of them are like that. And their parents created it by giving them everything and doing everything for them. I would have seniors who were terrified of going off to college because they didn't know how to do laundry, heat a frozen pizza, buy shampoo, make a bed, or basically any skill necessary for survival. They also couldn't deal with their own problems or organize their own time. We were required to post assignments on the web where parents could check them. A lot of parents would check it from work during the day then text their kids to tell them which books they needed to bring home--and I'm talking about juniors and seniors in high school. I actually had kids tell me sometimes that an assignment wasn't done because "my mom forgot".

Aceon6
12-21-2010, 03:25 PM
IMO, this is the biggest generational shift since the 60s and many of us are just plain having a hard time figuring it all out. Being a boomer myself, where independence and self-sufficiency were prized above many other things, I'm puzzled by younger folks who couldn't fight their way out of a brown paper bag without assistance. Perhaps that's why I'm grumpier than usual at work.

immoimeme
12-21-2010, 03:39 PM
My theory is with each passing decade your bullshit radar improves that you have less and less tolerance for crap.

C'est exactement cela :smokin:

Twilight1
12-21-2010, 03:46 PM
I'm puzzled by younger folks who couldn't fight their way out of a brown paper bag without assistance.

This reminds of phone calls I used to get from my son's grade 4 teacher. It was nothing for this woman to call me once a week to tell me what my son was or was not doing and how I need to do this and that 'for' him. I understand he is 9 but a slow development in self- motivation and taking responsibility for personal choices also needs to be learned at some point too. There is no way my son is going to be one of those 'I can't do it so save me' kids...

He is turning 11 and he can make his own lunch, knows when he gets home he feeds the cat, reads a book, does any homework, eats dinner THEN gets to do what he wants (unless it is karate night)

Aceon6
12-21-2010, 03:53 PM
He is turning 11 and he can make his own lunch, knows when he gets home he feeds the cat, reads a book, does any homework, eats dinner THEN gets to do what he wants (unless it is karate night)

Props to you Twilight. I want to hire your son when he's ready.

snoopy
12-21-2010, 03:59 PM
WRT work, I had a discussion with the hiring manager – who recruits from several Midwestern colleges – about recent grads. In our field at least, they have changed the way they teach the subject material – almost solely focusing on theory and “the big picture”. I guess “in theory”, this sounds efficient and reasonable. Who wants to do drills after all, such a waste of time, right? But in practice, the kids we have hired can not apply that theory to save their life. And entry level jobs are all about peeling back layers and solving problems, not setting policy. So yes it is annoying that the recent hires cannot figure out how to do things without major supervision. It is almost like they don’t have the educational background at all.

Dragonlady
12-21-2010, 04:00 PM
The fact that the younger generation sees themselves as equal is a direct result of the global social tendencies. I don't see any problems with that. If some older people have difficulties with the younger generation, in 99.9% of cases they remind you of their older age just because they don't have anything else to be proud of. Those older people who got successful in the life, don't need to do that. As the result they are usually the most valuable advisers and I respect them for that.

Many young people donít see themselves as equal, they see themselves as superior. And those who feel thusly entitled also feel that they should be respected, even when theyíve done nothing to earn respect. I see a lot of that. Then they get pissy when others donít acknowledge their superiority or give them what they feel is their due.

I find that as I age, I have a much lower tolerance for bullshit and Iím more apt to call someone on it. I was less likely to speak up when I was younger, but that was probably due to lack of confidence, or perhaps because I was raised to respect my elders, even when I didnít necessarily agree with them, and to treat them with respect.

I also think that a lot of grumpiness stems from poor health. I consider myself very fortunate to be in good health, reasonably fit and free of pain. So many of my friends have serious health issues which impact on the quality of their lives. My best friend gets grumpy when her knees bother her which is any time she walks any sort of distance. A Sunday walk through the Distillery District in Toronto, with its cobblestone streets, resulted in three days of serious pain. That would make anyone grumpy.

aliceanne
12-21-2010, 04:38 PM
Do people's levels of intolerance get higher as they get older?

My mum who is in her mid-60's certainly complains about a lot more things but is also a lot more racist than she used to be. But there is also a woman here at work who is also in her 60s and seems to hate so many people and always complaining.

Maybe I see it more because of the particular people I am around. But they have also had those shows about Grumpy Old Men and Women.

Is it just me or is it something that really is quite common?

I just know I certainly don't want to end up like that!

Getting stuck in a rut and being afraid to change will make you grumpy at any age. Also being negative is safer for some people. Showing enthusiasm and reaching out to new people and experiences risks rejection and put down, but if you start out being negative you put the other person on the defensive.

Maybe older people just have deeper ruts to climb out of? I speak as one of the elders :)

Anita18
12-21-2010, 08:00 PM
This reminds of phone calls I used to get from my son's grade 4 teacher. It was nothing for this woman to call me once a week to tell me what my son was or was not doing and how I need to do this and that 'for' him. I understand he is 9 but a slow development in self- motivation and taking responsibility for personal choices also needs to be learned at some point too. There is no way my son is going to be one of those 'I can't do it so save me' kids...

He is turning 11 and he can make his own lunch, knows when he gets home he feeds the cat, reads a book, does any homework, eats dinner THEN gets to do what he wants (unless it is karate night)
A lot of kids will eventually figure it out. I was coddled until college, because my dad is paranoid and wouldn't let me do ANYTHING by myself out in the real world because he was afraid I'd be kidnapped. :lol: In college I figured out independence pretty quickly. My roommate back in freshman year was seriously coddled - she ran out of body wash and called her mom across the country to send her some. I was like, "Just give me some cash and I'll get you some body wash from Target on my bus ride back from the rink!" :rofl:

I'd like to think that eventually she's more independent now, but I'm not so sure. :o Amusingly enough she became our college valedictorian (while I was not even in the top half of my class GPA-wise :slinkaway: ), so I guess common sense ability doesn't come into play until you get out into the real world.

And I'm still a procrastinator, although I always get my work done so I haven't learned that lesson yet. :lol: I was also shy and a pushover until my teens, but I've grown out of that now. I'm thinking that many of the older folk here have forgotten what they were like in their 20s. :lol: Sure it's no excuse for outright lazy uselessness (I'm surrounded by extremely self-motivated young people so I guess I'm biased), but most of us are still figuring stuff out.