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chipso1
12-13-2010, 03:49 AM
One of my friends who trains at the Broadmoor said Tom Z doesn't give Ryan alot of 'attention'. Meaning he doesn't really care about Ryan's training or anything.

ETA: This was when Brandon Mroz became a breakout star, like in 2009.

I heard this also. I think this is also partly why Jeremy left CoSprings in 2009. The tension between him and Brandon at the USOC Media Summit in summer 2009 was visible...

victoriaheidi
12-13-2010, 04:05 AM
He must be doing something "right" that many of his students are loyal enough to stay. Someone like Alex Gilles has good basics but is getting no where and it seems like she's been forgotten by him. Her placements are getting worse.

I think you said it best: he's got too many skaters to have a flock of perfect skaters. Not that I think he's a bad coach or that his students aren't good.

For Rachael, I think a coaching change is necessary because I think she needs fresh perspective. It's too early to decide for Agnes. I think Tom has helped her a lot already. He did take her from a nervous kid who couldn't skate cleanly in competition-ever-to a young lady who doesn't panic in competition. Alexe may benefit from some more time-she herself said that this is the first season where *she* has been the sole focus in her family. I think they all have potential (yes, even Rachael) and just don't know how to get from where they are now to where they want to be.

victoriaheidi
12-13-2010, 04:22 AM
I really hope that Rachael makes the leap to a new coach sooner rather than later, so she can get comfortable in a training situation close to Stanford well before she begins attending there. That will give her greater stability next year, and help her really make those changes she's been focusing on.

Another thing: I was so afraid based off of something Rachael said that she was going to wait until the summer to make the transition...BAD idea! I almost think it would be better for her to finish out the season with two coaches than to wait.

Debbie S
12-13-2010, 04:41 AM
One of my friends who trains at the Broadmoor said Tom Z doesn't give Ryan alot of 'attention'. Meaning he doesn't really care about Ryan's training or anything.I have heard the same thing about Jeremy when he trained there. What I heard is that Jeremy could only get a lesson at 6 am, even when he was nat'l champion.

In Tom Z's Oly blog, I think he mentioned something about pushing his male senior skaters to do a quad in the SP cost him Jeremy as a student. I think there was more to it than that. Whatever the reason, I'd say it was a good move for Jeremy.


I wonder if Patrick Chan is on one of those poster boards?Since Patrick trains at the Broadmoor rink now, I would doubt it. ;)

mysticchic
12-13-2010, 04:43 AM
I'm not a fan of the guy and after watching the final I not a fan anymore. Poor Rachael was very upset and there he was grinning away for the cameras. Not a pat on the hand or anything. Chan is there because he loves the dartfish. And from what I have seen with Ryan B, I don't think anyone could say anything to him and he would listen. Maybe a long time ago he did.
I think Tom and his teams do well with skaters until they become contenders, then they seem to get stuck.

PEKINGMOO
12-13-2010, 04:44 AM
His doing push-ups in the Kiss and Cry a few weeks ago after Rachel's skate was such a douchey, attention whore moment. Not sure if commentary was joking that he did that stunt 3 times because he didn't realize the camera's weren't rolling during his first few attempts.

alilou
12-13-2010, 04:51 AM
Chan is there because he loves the dartfish.
Exactly. Chan doesn't train with TomZ, he trains with Kristy Krall (Ithink that's her name) - but in the same arena.


His doing push-ups in the Kiss and Cry a few weeks ago after Rachel's skate was such a douchey, attention whore moment. Not sure if commentary was joking that he did that stunt 3 times because he didn't realize the camera's weren't rolling during his first few attempts.

Watching the live-feed on skatebuzz you actually saw him doing it twice, so I wouldn't be surprised if there was a third time just to make sure the cameras caught it.

jlai
12-13-2010, 05:05 AM
I've always thought that Tom Z's emphasis on hard work over talent is why he ends up with the skaters he has. Just mho

luCN
12-13-2010, 05:19 AM
The only thing I curious about is why nearly all his skaters's programs are so boring except Abott...

flyingsit
12-13-2010, 01:53 PM
Clearly he is good at teaching jumps and consistency.

Jumps, yes. Consistency, no. The only one of his skaters in recent years who has been known for consistency is Rachael. Neither Mroz, Bradley, Abbott (when he was there), nor any of his other female skaters have had any sort of consistency in competition.

However, consistency as a whole is really rare in skating at this level; I think a lot of us got so used to Kwan, Slutskaya, Sarah Hughes, etc. who were all remarkably consistent skaters that we took it for granted. In recent years there have been very few consistent skaters, in any discipline except dance.

museksk8r
12-13-2010, 04:49 PM
However, consistency as a whole is really rare in skating at this level; I think a lot of us got so used to Kwan, Slutskaya, Sarah Hughes, etc. who were all remarkably consistent skaters that we took it for granted. In recent years there have been very few consistent skaters, in any discipline except dance.

Flutz calls, lip calls, UR and DG calls have made a huge difference in skaters' consistency going from 6.0 to COP. Sarah Hughes, for example, would have been one of those skaters who would have to completely relearn the Lutz jump from square one had she competed under COP. Also, she often under-rotated her flip jump, so she would have had to learn to achieve better height on that jump as well. Her triple+triple combinations, like Surya Bonaly's, were under-rotated most of the time as well. Most skaters used to rest during their footwork and didn't have to worry with changing edges and having gumby positions in spins during 6.0 days. Now skaters have no rest in COP programs (and if you do rest too much, your levels and PCS suffer as a result), so of course their consistency has suffered as a result.

kappa_1
12-13-2010, 06:40 PM
Wasn't there something on the internet about how Tom Z. uses negative reinforcements to get results? Like how he would make poster boards with his students' rivals and put them by the barrier as they train? Or am I just making this up? :confused:

FYI negative reinforcement= taking something away to encourage a behavior.
positive reinforcement= introducing stimulus to encourage behavior.

Sorry for the douchery, it's just the intro psych student in me :)

ryanbfan
12-13-2010, 07:07 PM
I'm glad to see alot of people on here are not fond of Tom Z. I am not either. In fact, I find him to be an incredibly huge douchebag.

And Ryan won't switch coaches cause he has been with Tom since he was 5.

Skittl1321
12-13-2010, 08:00 PM
Chan is there because he loves the dartfish.

/sorry off topic

Is Dartfish rare? My (former, I'm not skating now) club has it, and we have a rink in the middle of nowhere. A few skaters have gone to nationals (not as seniors) but it's not like it's a "name" club.

Couldn't Chan find Dartfish in lots of places?

Debbie S
12-13-2010, 08:18 PM
Couldn't Chan find Dartfish in lots of places?He probably could, but I'm sure he'd prefer to train at a major training center with other top senior-level men. I think he said as much in one of the interviews last year. I believe it was Lori Nichol who recommended he work with Christy Krall on his jumps, and they seemed to hit it off well - I'm sure that was a factor in his relocation.