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Polymer Bob
12-01-2010, 04:08 PM
Maybe skaters should be judged on how badly a fall interferes with the program. If a skater gets up quickly and resumes his program smoothly, he gets deducted less.
We can call it the FRS ( fall recovery score ). :)

gkelly
12-01-2010, 04:17 PM
Well, that's where they (undocumented) effect on the Performance/Execution comes in.

But it's subjective. Some judges may find the same fall to interfere more with the program, some not so much.

And fans too. In general I think fans tend to get more hung up on falls than judges do, because they tend to be looking at the overall impression and not concentrating on all the picky details of the remaining elements.

Marco
12-01-2010, 04:58 PM
I don't get what your post has to do with SPs though. The purpose of the SP was to always to compare skaters executing similar elements to judge their mastery of their elements and how well they execute them. Of course with COP "getting rid" of comparative judging, I'm finding it harder to find a reason to have a SP which serves no real purpose other than simply having two nights of competition.

The sp is different from the lp in that it has more restrictions on jumps and more requirements on spins. Since there are only 3 instead of 7 or 8 jump passes, each mistake constitutes a larger % of total TES and thus must more costly. All those god awful camel and flying upright spins this season are really making the good spinners stand out. And the requirement on the layback hurts a lot of skaters (Suguri, Ando) just like the axel requirement hurt Lambiel (and Zhang?).

(On that note, I wish the axel and layback requirement would rotate so next season it could be...say, lutz and camel, and sal and sit the season after)

What I meant by my first paragraph was, the recent changes to COP are encouraging skaters to risk difficult elements and push the sport forward technically (2 quads for guys, solo 3axel for ladies, 70% for under-rotation, higher base mark for harder jumps, lesser GOE penalty for failures), instead of skate beautifully and properly like they were encouraging skaters to do last year (big GOEs for quality, big GOE penalty for failures, downgrades). And when the system encourages one way over the other, you can't blame the skaters for following. (there were probably less mistakes in sps last year because of the harsh downgrades and negative GOEs in place)

However the system is changed, the same posters still complain either way, so I guess there's no way to shut them up.

gkelly
12-01-2010, 05:05 PM
What I meant by my first paragraph was, the recent changes to COP are encouraging skaters to risk difficult elements and push the sport forward technically (2 quads for guys, solo 3axel for ladies, 70% for under-rotation, higher base mark for harder jumps, lesser GOE penalty for failures), instead of skate beautifully and properly like they were encouraging skaters to do last year (big GOEs for quality, big GOE penalty for failures, downgrades). And when the system encourages one way over the other, you can't blame the skaters for following.

Yeah. And it's not that the judges are doing anything different this year either in terms of how they award GOEs and PCS. Their rules haven't changed (except that now they see the < and << symbols; they didn't see the < last year).

The rule changes that Marco mentioned are in the system, in the scale of values, itself, not in the action of the judges. They happen to be changes that make it easier to win by trying difficult jumps and failing.