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Jenna
07-22-2010, 07:07 AM
Someone had to take the Americans originally. I just don't see RUS freely choosing an American replacement. A European or Asian skater is likely the replacement. And..please. You make it sound as though the OGM fiasco was insignificant. Evan handled the situation well, but the feds' "you are the true champion" left a bad taste in everyone's mouth.

oleada
07-22-2010, 07:16 AM
I won't get into the whole Evan/Plushy debate because I avoid both of them like the plague, but I'd like to point out that some of these skaters were not entitled to a GP event (Simpson/Miller) or were not entitled to a second one (Zawadzki)

pinky166
07-23-2010, 02:08 AM
I'm curious to see Min-Jung skate at the show the next few days, I believe she is performing her new SP in it. If she is looking strong then I think it will help her case to get another GP. She has a lot of potential and I think she deserves a 2nd assignment, so good luck to her. I also think she has a competition in Korea coming up in August so that should also give people an idea of how she's faring.

ainouta
07-24-2010, 02:20 AM
I'm curious to see Min-Jung skate at the show the next few days, I believe she is performing her new SP in it. If she is looking strong then I think it will help her case to get another GP. She has a lot of potential and I think she deserves a 2nd assignment, so good luck to her. I also think she has a competition in Korea coming up in August so that should also give people an idea of how she's faring.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tzsb187hI7g

Too bad about the fall on the lutz, and she's still a little slow, but she looks much more finished off and elegant than she did last year. And that's probably the best layback of any of the Asian ladies, including Mao.

MikiAndoFan#1
07-24-2010, 02:34 AM
And that's probably the best layback of any of the Asian ladies, including Mao.

Min-Jung has a great Biellmann, not Layback. These are good Laybacks:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K5p3zrEI7N0 (at 2:25)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dq8knstUZls (at 1:54)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KoVsFRcxn4A (at 2:57)

Just a few examples.

:)

ainouta
07-24-2010, 02:40 AM
Min-Jung has a great Biellmann, not Layback. These are good Laybacks:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K5p3zrEI7N0 (at 2:25)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dq8knstUZls (at 1:54)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KoVsFRcxn4A (at 2:57)

Just a few examples.

:)

Compared to Nikodinov, of course not. But compared to, say, Miki or Yu-Na? Definitely. She actually puts her leg into a semi-attitude position!

pinky166
07-24-2010, 03:20 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tzsb187hI7g

Too bad about the fall on the lutz, and she's still a little slow, but she looks much more finished off and elegant than she did last year. And that's probably the best layback of any of the Asian ladies, including Mao.

Yeah, I agree, she is coming along nicely. The jumps look better, especially the landing edge coming out of them, hard to tell about rotation from those videos but she does look more muscular and less gawky than she did back in the winter. She still has a lot of things to work on but it's only July and by the fall she likely will have improved her expression and speed a bit. Among the other girls in consideration for a second GP, I think she is very deserving. Her ballanchine physique also helps add to her elegance and presence on the ice, and of course the flexibility is quite stunning.

I think COR should give her Yuna's spot. She's not American, she's cute, and she has the build of a Russian prima ballerina so I think she'd be welcome there :)

Ziggy
07-27-2010, 12:30 AM
Someone had to take the Americans originally. I just don't see RUS freely choosing an American replacement. A European or Asian skater is likely the replacement. And..please. You make it sound as though the OGM fiasco was insignificant. Evan handled the situation well, but the feds' "you are the true champion" left a bad taste in everyone's mouth.

Yes, let's rehash that dead horse again.

Russian Fed is not stupid and they would surely not let something like that affect their present decisions.

As with anything, it's probably a case of reciprocation. If we give your skater that vacant spot, what can you do for us?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tzsb187hI7g

Too bad about the fall on the lutz, and she's still a little slow, but she looks much more finished off and elegant than she did last year. And that's probably the best layback of any of the Asian ladies, including Mao.

The lutz went totally wrong and she appears to still be doing the salchow as the off-steps jump.

Flying uprights should be banned. :P

Choreography is a steaming pile of elephant dung.

I don't get your layback comment at all. It looks quite weak.

But yeah, her movements definitely seem more refined and she is more elegant than last season.

But that was sloooooooooooooooooow. Maybe because of the show size rink and the lighting though?

pinky166
07-27-2010, 01:22 AM
Yes, let's rehash that dead horse again.

Russian Fed is not stupid and they would surely not let something like that affect their present decisions.

As with anything, it's probably a case of reciprocation. If we give your skater that vacant spot, what can you do for us?



The lutz went totally wrong and she appears to still be doing the salchow as the off-steps jump.

Flying uprights should be banned. :P

Choreography is a steaming pile of elephant dung.

I don't get your layback comment at all. It looks quite weak.

But yeah, her movements definitely seem more refined and she is more elegant than last season.

But that was sloooooooooooooooooow. Maybe because of the show size rink and the lighting though?

It's an exhibition, they don't have warm up or anything like that, I wouldn't read too much into it, even Yuna make a lot of mistakes on jumps she normally does so well in exhibition numbers. Plus after Worlds I'm guessing she's working more on fully rotating her triples rather than just landing them, so falling a lot would be expected. Her growth spurt has also probably shifted her center of gravity, so she's done a lot of adjusting.

As for the salchow, Min-Jung lips, so it wouldn't make since for her to do a 3f out of steps because the wrong edge deduction would bring it's value lower than that of a 3sal, which is her best jump. I guess she could do a 3lo instead but that's more prone to being downgraded...

Last season Min-Jung was doing 4 different triples in her programs - lutz, flip (lip), loop, sal - and on the JGP in the fall she was also doing the triple toe so at this point she has a more expansive technical repertoire than Dobbs and Lee, and most of the other people on the list for that matter.

I'm not saying Min-Jung is great, but at this point I don't think anyone else in consideration for a second spot is better than her, except for maybe Dobbs, but if she's still only doing toes, sals, and the occasional flip then I'm not even sure.

Ziggy
07-27-2010, 01:26 AM
I'm not saying Min-Jung is great, but at this point I don't think anyone else in consideration for a second spot is better than her, except for maybe Dobbs, but if she's still only doing toes, sals, and the occasional flip then I'm not even sure.

I think Marchei is a better skater.

But then her WS is low, I think.

pinky166
07-27-2010, 01:54 AM
I think Marchei is a better skater.

But then her WS is low, I think.

I guess. I'm not a big Marchei fan, and her season's best score is 34 on the list while Min-Jung's is 26 and about 6 points higher. So I guess in the eye's of the judges, Marchei isn't better, but I don't really know.

I'd be fine if the spots went to any combination of Kwak, Dobbs, Lee, or LaCoste but I'm really not a fan of McCorkell, Helgesson, or Samson. The others I don't really have an opinion about.

pinky166
07-27-2010, 03:45 AM
Just watched this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-IqGneZvfOA of Marchei from 2010 Euros, where she earned her SB score. I like the speed and her footwork but I'm not feeling the spins and her jumps are a bit skary :yikes: ....that first fall in particular looked very awkward and painful. And she does 3sal as her jump out of steps in the SP as well, so really it's not that big a deal, Phanuef does 3t as her jump out of steps and she finished 5th at Worlds this year...

So I stand behind my choice of Cheltzie and Min-Jung, and Dobbs for SA.

isk8junkie
07-27-2010, 12:52 PM
pinky 166 wrote:
Last season Min-Jung was doing 4 different triples in her programs - lutz, flip (lip), loop, sal - and on the JGP in the fall she was also doing the triple toe so at this point she has a more expansive technical repertoire than Dobbs and Lee, and most of the other people on the list for that matter.

I'm not saying Min-Jung is great, but at this point I don't think anyone else in consideration for a second spot is better than her, except for maybe Dobbs, but if she's still only doing toes, sals, and the occasional flip then I'm not even sure.

The quality of Cheltzie's jumps when she's on far surpasses Min Jung to be honest. I'm sure Cheltzie will improve her technical jump repertoire this season. I look forward to seeing how much Min Jung and Cheltzie have improved this season.

pinky166
07-27-2010, 10:25 PM
pinky 166 wrote:

The quality of Cheltzie's jumps when she's on far surpasses Min Jung to be honest. I'm sure Cheltzie will improve her technical jump repertoire this season. I look forward to seeing how much Min Jung and Cheltzie have improved this season.

I know, the same can be said of Dobbs, but now that the GOEs for jumps have been lowered, a really nice 3t or 3sal will not hold too much value, and with the new 2a rule, they'll have to at least try other jumps. I actually think this change in GOE is going to favor skaters who can do more kinds of triples but not neccessarily with lots of flow out.

fogerty
07-28-2010, 01:30 AM
I know, the same can be said of Dobbs, but now that the GOEs for jumps have been lowered, a really nice 3t or 3sal will not hold too much value, and with the new 2a rule, they'll have to at least try other jumps. I actually think this change in GOE is going to favor skaters who can do more kinds of triples but not neccessarily with lots of flow out.

I would imagine with the changes in rules that these skaters will be more than willing to put out more variety in their jumps. Just because they weren't in there programs before doesn't mean they can't be done, especially if they are worth more...all part of the strategy I would think...