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cruisin
07-12-2010, 12:35 AM
Don't know about journalists. Cops get warrants. Stores can't record audio, just video.

So, Mel had better not learn to sign. :D

Sorry, couldn't resist. I apologize if anyone feels it's not funny.

ArtisticFan
07-12-2010, 12:48 AM
I've never done investigative journalism, but my recordings of interviews and whatnot were always for accurately quoting people. On a few occasions politicians would say they didn't say something. One time playing it back to them and they stopped complaining.

Most people use such recordings to either start off negotiations (I have you on tape so you better start talking) or to protect themselves in a situation. I would be willing to bet Oksana did just that. She is probably aware that the tape doesn't hold much water legally, but it does in the public relations world. He was probably given warning that she would release it if he didn't step up to paying, cooperating, etc.

reckless
07-12-2010, 01:34 AM
Thanks for explaining. I thought a Federal law is above State law, guess I'm wrong.
It is interesting, though. What happens regarding journalists' recordings when they are doing journalist investigations, or cops putting recording device on their sources, or people capturing all kinds of incidents or events on their cellular phones?! What happens regarding stores having hiden cameras?
On criminal matters, state and federal laws are concurrent. It is only if there is a conflict in the law that federal law trumps state law. (That is under the Supremacy Clause of the US Constitution.) There is no federal law governing recordings that authorizes courts to use recordings without consent, so the state law remains in effect.

Wiretaps by police with a warrant are subject to exceptions to the California criminal law.

As for journalists, they are subject to the same law as the regular public. However, the law only prohibits recordings where the person unaware of the recording has an expectation of privacy. Therefore, recording someone in a store is usually permissible, because other people are present and it is a place open to the public. However, it can be problematic say if the recording takes place in a manager's office or a backroom.

Stores with hidden cameras are generally protected by the public nature of the store. However, many stores have signs alerting people to monitoring as a way of circumventing the law. You might be familiar with another common practice designed to deal with these laws -- when you call a company and get a recording telling you the call may be monitored or recorded for training or other purposes. That is designed to eliminate any argument that you had an expectation of privacy during the call.

FYI, before the "Do Not Call" list, I relied on this law to avoid telemarketers. Sometimes, when they start, they will tell you that the call is being recorded. If I didn't want to be bothered, I would say that I do not allow myself to be recorded. Since the callers had no control over recording devices, they would have to hang up to avoid violating the criminal law.

zowie
07-12-2010, 10:01 AM
..... but just that he will carry it on until she has run out of money trying to drag him down.

...and that's the unfortunate part of the justice system. Money wins.

cruisin
07-12-2010, 03:09 PM
...and that's the unfortunate part of the justice system. Money wins.

But it doesn't have to be that way. Gibson clearly has "issues", a real ugly side to him. But, by making this public his girlfriend threw down a gauntlet. I am sure that part of the reason she did it was that they are not married. She has a child with him and wants to be supported. Not being married, she might get decent child support, but not likely to get any sort of "alimony type" award. I am sure there is a monetary issue on both sides. She had to know what she was getting into, after his prior "explosions". Not blaming the victim, but it's always better to solve your disputes privately.

zowie
07-12-2010, 03:22 PM
But it doesn't have to be that way.


I think in general, it is that way.

attyfan
07-12-2010, 03:28 PM
Under California law, Penal Code section 632, it is illegal to tape a private phone call without every person's consent. A violation is a misdemeanor, subject to a possible $1,000 fine and, iirc, a short jail sentence. The recording also cannot be used in any judicial proceeding, except for a prosecution under that law. I believe a victim of a recording may also sue for $1,000. (I've had the law come up in a few cases, but it's been awhile, so I'm going on memory.)

Given this law, the Gibson recording cannot be used in court and Oksana could get in legal trouble for the recording. As a practical matter, the PR impact will probably mean nothing happens to her.

There is a California case, People v. Crow (1994) 28 Cal. App. 4th 440, that allows the recording to be used for impeachment. So, depending upon Gibson's testimony (if any) at any custody or support hearing, the tape may still be used.

Coco
07-12-2010, 03:31 PM
I wonder if her attorney is more at risk that Oksana. The penalties for secretly recording your jerk of a baby's daddy are so mild compared to what can be gained by releasing them publically.

But advising your client to break the law is a whole other kettle of fish.

We don't know that her attorney did that, but if I was his attorney, I'd be interested to know who helped her.

numbers123
07-12-2010, 06:17 PM
off the topic of recording conversations, and I was half alseep when I thought I heard this, but on the view this morning, Whoopie said that when people drink they say all sorts of things they don't mean.

That she knew Mel, he has been over to her house, that she never heard this type of language from him and that alcohol does a lot of stuff to people. And Joy Behar was screaming that he was a bigot. The producers were desperately trying to get them to go to commercial break.

Anyone else hear or see that? I was in that "I don't feel good took some cold medication in and out of sleeping mode"

orbitz
07-12-2010, 06:24 PM
Whoopie irrates me sometimes with her excuses. During the whole Chris Brown - Rhianne domestic abuse issue, Whoopie issued this warning on The View (I'm paraphrasing here...) "Ladies, if you hit a man, there's a good chance he's going to hit back... " I was like WTF? It's almost like she was giving Chris Brown an excuse to hit Rhianne if she hit him first.

I don't buy the excuse that being drunk make things come out of your mouth that you've never thought about. Of course Mel is not going to show his ugly side when he's among friends or the public. His image is/was that of an all around good guy, and he had to wear that mask all the time.

susan6
07-12-2010, 06:30 PM
In Vino Veritas. When you're drunk, the filter between your brain and your mouth goes away. Those thoughts were in Mel's head, and wine took away his inhibitions toward saying them. It's not that he turns into a racist/misogynist/antisemite because he's drunk.....instead, when he gets drunk he forgets to hide the fact that he IS all of those things.

StonewshMullet
07-12-2010, 07:01 PM
Whoopie irrates me sometimes with her excuses. During the whole Chris Brown - Rhianne domestic abuse issue, Whoopie issued this warning on The View (I'm paraphrasing here...) "Ladies, if you hit a man, there's a good chance he's going to hit back... " I was like WTF? It's almost like she was giving Chris Brown an excuse to hit Rhianne if she hit him first.

I don't buy the excuse that being drunk make things come out of your mouth that you've never thought about. Of course Mel is not going to show his ugly side when he's among friends or the public. His image is/was that of an all around good guy, and he had to wear that mask all the time.

She also defended Michael Vick saying things like "They're dogs not people". Cruelty to animals is usually the first step towards cruely to people. As for Gibson ,he basically admitted to assaulting Oksana on and could end up in jail.

Rex
07-12-2010, 07:41 PM
In Vino Veritas. When you're drunk, the filter between your brain and your mouth goes away. Those thoughts were in Mel's head, and wine took away his inhibitions toward saying them. It's not that he turns into a racist/misogynist/antisemite because he's drunk.....instead, when he gets drunk he forgets to hide the fact that he IS all of those things.

A drunken man speaks a sober mind.

cruisin
07-12-2010, 07:56 PM
Whoopie irrates me sometimes with her excuses. During the whole Chris Brown - Rhianne domestic abuse issue, Whoopie issued this warning on The View (I'm paraphrasing here...) "Ladies, if you hit a man, there's a good chance he's going to hit back... " I was like WTF? It's almost like she was giving Chris Brown an excuse to hit Rhianne if she hit him first.

I agree with you. But, on some level Whoopie is right. Chris Brown had no right to hit Rhianne, regardless of her hitting him first. But, she had no right to hit him either. And any woman who doesn't appreciate that by hitting some guy, you run the risk of escalating the abuse to physical, is foolish. She doesn't deserve it, but it's not the best idea.

mmscfdcsu
07-12-2010, 11:23 PM
In Vino Veritas. When you're drunk, the filter between your brain and your mouth goes away. Those thoughts were in Mel's head, and wine took away his inhibitions toward saying them. It's not that he turns into a racist/misogynist/antisemite because he's drunk.....instead, when he gets drunk he forgets to hide the fact that he IS all of those things.

That is an old wives tale. It doesn't work like that.