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dinakt
11-23-2010, 03:10 AM
Yasmin is not eligible for Worlds anyway.
Junior GPF ( and Worlds?), Senior nationals- right?

burntBREAD
11-23-2010, 03:11 AM
:confused:
International judges gave Nagasu excellent PCS at the Olympics last year having only seen her in the GP(not counting junior events). Unlike Wagner, she had never competed at Worlds or 4CC's. Her "boost" last year came from improvements she had made to her skating. Not to mention the fact that her PCS were always pretty decent even when most of her jumps were being <.

So yes, if you have the skating skills to back it up, you can expect high PCS and overall scores.


Well, the PCS at the Olympics was generally inflated anyways, but Mirai still got a bit hosed on those in the SP, garnering (I think?) only the 10th highest PCS with the 4th highest TES. But more exposure almost definitely = more PCS

oleada
11-23-2010, 03:18 AM
Junior GPF ( and Worlds?), Senior nationals- right?

Yeah, she's eligible for Junior Worlds, but won't be eligible for senior level ISU championships until the 2012/2013 season.

ETA: I agree that Gao is needed at Junior Worlds. The international field is deeper this year, and not sending the best could mean that the US could finish as the 4th country, behind Russia, Japan and China.

Mayra
11-23-2010, 03:26 AM
But more exposure almost definitely = more PCS

It certainly helps but it's not guaranteed. Ashley Wagner has been skating in the GP for four seasons, has competed at Worlds, 4CC's and the GPF. She competed in the JGP, the JGPF and Jr. Worlds twice. Exposure or lack thereof has not been the problem with her PCS scores.

burntBREAD
11-23-2010, 03:28 AM
It certainly helps but it's not guaranteed. Ashley Wagner has been skating in the GP for four seasons, has competed at Worlds, 4CC's and the GPF. She competed in the JGP, the JGPF and Jr. Worlds twice. Exposure or lack thereof has not been the problem with her PCS scores.

Then maybe this is where her PCS scores top off? :confused: Unfortunately...:(

But it has been noted in other threads that her SS and TR could definitely be improved, and IMO, the music and choreography are quite generic and don't really work for her (Polovetsian Dances and now Malaguena for Ashley? No.) I wish she kept that Led Zeppelin SP this year! :wall:

mgobluegirl
11-23-2010, 03:56 AM
Only the Senior national champion in each discipline is guaranteed a trip to Worlds, according to the current USFS rulebook

I thought they got rid of that provision after the 2009 season? I could be wrong, but I think they now reserve the right to send whomever they want, regardless of placement at nationals. That being said, I would be completely shocked if they went with anyone other than the top 2 finishers.

Sylvia
11-23-2010, 04:20 AM
I thought they got rid of that provision after the 2009 season? I could be wrong, but I think they now reserve the right to send whomever they want, regardless of placement at nationals.
That's for Olympic team selection. The current World team selection criteria as published in the current USFS rulebook:

ICR 6.04
A. World Championships:
The U.S. World Team shall be selected from those athletes who are ISU senior age eligible and shall include the current U.S. champion in each discipline. The remaining selections shall be based upon the results of the two most recent U.S. Figure Skating Championships, the most recent World Championship, the most recent Four Continents Championship and all other international events; however, the International Committee may consider extenuating circumstances.

gkelly
11-23-2010, 04:31 AM
http://www.usfigureskating.org/Content/2011%20Rulebook.pdf

ICR 6.04 A. World Championships:


The U.S. World Team shall be selected from those athletes who are ISU senior age eligible and shall include the current U.S. champion in each discipline. The remaining selections shall be based upon...

See D. U.S. Figure Skating Olympic Team Selection Process. That's probably what you're thinking of, where the champion is not guaranteed a spot, although results of Nationals are the most important criterion.

Of course, those rules may change again before the next Olympics comes along, so who knows?

Coco
11-23-2010, 04:39 AM
I think skate order had EVERYTHING to do with Mirai and Rachael's marks in Vancouver, sad to say.

I hope these conspiracy theories aren't true, but it was wierd how once everyone else's placements were secure, Mirai's PCS shot up. Mirai was the final skater, iirc. And prior to the podium being established, Flatt got two of the only non-obvious downgrades in the whole competition.

I think Mirai deserved her LP PCS, and maybe Flatt got the benefit of the doubt too often and was the only one to deserve those downgrades, but still, I just want consistency from the judges.

mgobluegirl
11-23-2010, 04:12 PM
That's for Olympic team selection. The current World team selection criteria as published in the current USFS rulebook:

That probably is what I was thinking of. Thanks!

pinky166
11-23-2010, 04:26 PM
Yeah, she's eligible for Junior Worlds, but won't be eligible for senior level ISU championships until the 2012/2013 season.

ETA: I agree that Gao is needed at Junior Worlds. The international field is deeper this year, and not sending the best could mean that the US could finish as the 4th country, behind Russia, Japan and China.

Gao is not needed at Junior Worlds when there's a host of talented junior ladies on top of Siraj, Zawadzki, Baga, Lam, Cesario, Gong, etc who all all still eligible to compete there. I doubt if Christina skates really well at nationals USFSA will intentionally keep her out of the top 2 just so she can go to junior worlds, it would be silly, especially considering only 3 ladies can go to junior worlds and there's about 9 ladies besides Christina who are age eligible and would be capable of doing very well there.

pinky166
11-23-2010, 04:35 PM
But if Gao scored 47.66 in the SP at Worlds like she did at JGP Germany, she'd be lucky to make the cut for the LP. And if she made the cut for the LP, she'd be so buried, she wouldn't get the PCS she needed to even crack the top 10. Gao can lay an egg just as good as the rest of them.

For one that score was at a Junior event where 1.) the PCS are kept low and 2.) you can't add a combo to the jump out of steps. At a senior event, if Christina fell on her 3f she could at a combo to her 3lo or 3lz (whichever she decides to do) and that would get her a few extra points and her PCS would also likely be higher. If Flatt or Wagner fell on a jump in the SP and didn't do a combination their scores would probably be comparable - when you fall on a jump and don't do a combo your scores are much lower than if you are clean, that's true for everyone, so it doesn't really put Christina at a disadvantage. The FS matters more anyways, both Christina and Rachael have had problems in the SP before but I've never seen either of them bomb a FS like Alissa, Mirai, and Ashley have a number of times.

5Ali3
11-23-2010, 07:20 PM
See D. U.S. Figure Skating Olympic Team Selection Process. That's probably what you're thinking of, where the champion is not guaranteed a spot, although results of Nationals are the most important criterion.

Of course, those rules may change again before the next Olympics comes along, so who knows?

Highly unlikely - if the results of Olympic-year Nationals determine who makes the Olympic team, then Nationals would be functioning as an Olympic Trial and the USOC would have the rights, including TV revenue. The rule change that eliminated the provision that the U.S. Champion was guaranteed a spot on the Olympic Team if otherwise eligible was aimed squarely at eliminating the USOC's claim on Nationals. It was actually quite a concern over the last quad; USOC claims, fairly accurately, that U.S. Figure Skating just goes down the results of Nationals in order to pick the Olympic team.

Jayar
11-23-2010, 08:51 PM
My thoughts:

Flatt :hat1:
Nagasu :summer:
Wagner:rollin:
Gao :wideeyes:
Dobbs:rockstar:
Siraj:swoon:
Zawadzki :biggrinbo
Lam:kickass:
Gilles:cheer:
Zhang: :encore:

In other words, I love them all! :)

Polymer Bob
11-23-2010, 09:08 PM
USOC claims, fairly accurately, that U.S. Figure Skating just goes down the results of Nationals in order to pick the Olympic team.

Well actually, the USFSA only makes a recommendation for the Olympic teams. If the USOC wanted to get tough, they could use the results of other competitions to pick the Olympic team.