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oleada
09-06-2010, 08:05 PM
Further, I've seen Christina skate live, so that makes a difference.

So have a lot of people on this forum.

The only thing you are doing with your incessant hyping of Christina is:

a. setting her up for failure if she doesn't meet the lofty expectations you've set out of her.
b. disappointment and criticism when/if she does falter, or when people see her and she's not the next savior of figure skating like you've described her to be
c. create animosity toward her from people who haven't even seen her skate because you won't shut up about her.

I like Sylvia's wait-and-see approach.

sk9tingfan
09-06-2010, 08:19 PM
So have a lot of people on this forum.

The only thing you are doing with your incessant hyping of Christina is:

a. setting her up for failure if she doesn't meet the lofty expectations you've set out of her.
b. disappointment and criticism when/if she does falter, or when people see her and she's not the next savior of figure skating like you've described her to be
c. create animosity toward her from people who haven't even seen her skate because you won't shut up about her.

I like Sylvia's wait-and-see approach.

I absolutely agree with you and Sylvia. That would apply not only to Gao but also every other skater. IMO, it's those skaters and their coaches who are circumspect and promise little but deliver much and/or the unexpected who are in the best position. I can think of a particular coach and skater(s) who haven't learned that lesson and have consistently set themselves up for relative failure.

JerseySlore
09-06-2010, 08:48 PM
I absolutely agree with you and Sylvia. That would apply not only to Gao but also every other skater. IMO, it's those skaters and their coaches who are circumspect and promise little but deliver much and/or the unexpected who are in the best position. I can think of a particular coach and skater(s) who haven't learned that lesson and have consistently set themselves up for relative failure.

Word.

pinky166
09-06-2010, 09:10 PM
I hope you guys know that I say all this lightheartedly - it's fun to pick favorites or up-and-comers and then wait and see what happens, if you're predictions are right, then it's a nice bonus, but if they aren't, then it's still interesting to see the outcome and try to understand why it turned out that way.

So if Christina bombs at nationals this year, it will be just as interesting to see as if she wins nationals this year, I personally think she won't bomb, but things happen and all that. If anything the summer results show just how unpredictable skaters can be, seeing Gong ahead of Flatt, etc. But I like to make predictions/wishes in advance because if they turn out to be right then it's cool. I always liked Yuna better than Mao but watching them back in 05 and 06 I never thought Yuna would ever surpass Mao, but then she did, so it was fun to see.

sk9tingfan
09-06-2010, 09:18 PM
Word.

:confused:

JerseySlore
09-06-2010, 09:21 PM
:confused:

Meant 'well said' ;)

chipso1
09-06-2010, 09:24 PM
I hope you guys know that I say all this lightheartedly - it's fun to pick favorites or up-and-comers and then wait and see what happens, if you're predictions are right, then it's a nice bonus, but if they aren't, then it's still interesting to see the outcome and try to understand why it turned out that way.

So if Christina bombs at nationals this year, it will be just as interesting to see as if she wins nationals this year, I personally think she won't bomb, but things happen and all that. If anything the summer results show just how unpredictable skaters can be, seeing Gong ahead of Flatt, etc. But I like to make predictions/wishes in advance because if they turn out to be right then it's cool. I always liked Yuna better than Mao but watching them back in 05 and 06 I never thought Yuna would ever surpass Mao, but then she did, so it was fun to see.

Yes, we understand why you're hyping her, but it's beginning to sound like a broken record at this point. :barrel

sk9tingfan
09-06-2010, 09:29 PM
Meant 'well said' ;)

Thank you, JerseySlore! :D

gkelly
09-06-2010, 10:07 PM
As I said, there's no good way around the issue, as the byes due to GP assignments are shaping the US nationals competitor list and are not completely within USFSA control. (Which I think is a bit weird. USFSA should have complete control over who compete at their own nationals to make sure the best get there.)

How do they know who are the best? The skaters have to have competed in the past to earn that consideration. If they were top 5 in seniors at Nationals last year, then they're in. Otherwise, they have to prove themselves. If they really are the best, they'll get there.

By "complete control," are you talking about trying to get the very best skater in to Nationals, or trying to keep the not-good-enough skaters out? Because in between there's a whole group of skaters who are more or less as good as each other, good enough not to embarrass themselves at Nationals or senior B/JGP events and to defeat any other skater in that group depending who's having a good day whenever they compete against each other. If you're using several months of results from different events with different fields and different judging panels at different times of the season, there may not be a clear way to tell who's the "15th-best US senior lady" and who's the "25th-best." You'd have to let them all compete against each other directly to sort it out, and even then they might switch places between short program and long.

If some are qualifying to Nationals through JGP or senior B or Grand Prix byes and others are qualifying through sectionals, and if the number of slots at Nationals and the number of byes is limited, it's always possible that any given deserving skater will miss out this year.


The only things I can think of is 1) closer monitoring prior to international assignments and 2) being more stringent with byes. Or a combination of both.

Closer monitoring will help in deciding which skaters to send to JGP and senior B internationals and to Skate America. Thinning out deep sectional fields could be one consideration in deciding whom to send where, but it's not the only factor.

For foreign Grand Prixs it won't help much. If USFS thinks a skater with a foreign GP assignment didn't look good in monitoring, forbidding them to accept the invitation isn't going to guarantee that the host federation will replace them with another US skater. It might just mean one less US skater on the Grand Prix and one less skater at Nationals.


ETA: Here's another thought: USFS could spread out the sectionals through two weekends, so a lower-ranked skater going to, say, Skate America, will still go to a sectionals the weekend before or after (eta: if that skater does poorly in the gp, say 10th, 11th or sth).

Again, that's not going to help get any other deserving skaters to Nationals -- if anything, it could mean that someone who otherwise could have gone will have to stay home.

All this "closer monitoring" would achieve in these cases would be to keep some borderline-national-quality skaters out of Nationals. Which could make Nationals slightly smaller and less expensive. It won't do much to help other borderline skaters that by some criteria might seem more deserving.

LilJen
09-06-2010, 10:07 PM
I have hearsay :sekret: information that Kimmie is not planning on competing this season. I guess we'll have to wait until the qualifying season begins for an official confirmation.

:(

jlai
09-06-2010, 10:55 PM
How do they know who are the best?

I think we are drifting off-topic, so let me take this discussion to the new thread: "Hypothetical: Would a Qualifying Score system for US Nationals be more fair?" Which is right where our current discussion belongs.

pinky166
09-06-2010, 11:36 PM
Yes, we understand why you're hyping her, but it's beginning to sound like a broken record at this point. :barrel

I just think it's funny. But you know, I like a great number of skaters, most of them just aren't in the US right now, as currently most of the US ladies are rather ZZZ in my opinion.

Seeing as this is the senior ladies thread though anyone know if Blake Rosenthal is going to compete this season? I know she's starting Harvard, but it is very close to the Skating Club of Boston, so potentially she could train there if she wanted to continue. She's a very pretty skater, her jumps are a mess sometimes but if she starts working with Mark and Peter they may be able to help her with that.

Jenna
09-06-2010, 11:52 PM
A little OT hre, but did Lam really achieve that total score with 3 falls in the competition? If that is true, I cannot wait to see how high she scoes if she goes clean.

Polymer Bob
09-07-2010, 12:07 AM
For foreign Grand Prixs it won't help much. If USFS thinks a skater with a foreign GP assignment didn't look good in monitoring, forbidding them to accept the invitation isn't going to guarantee that the host federation will replace them with another US skater. It might just mean one less US skater on the Grand Prix and one less skater at Nationals.


Interesting point. Can the USFSA stop a skater from going to a foreign Grand Prix event?
Can the USFSA stop a skater from going to the Final?

haribobo
09-07-2010, 12:50 AM
A little OT hre, but did Lam really achieve that total score with 3 falls in the competition? If that is true, I cannot wait to see how high she scoes if she goes clean.

:encore::rollin: :eek: :cheer: :cheer2: VIVANESSA!!! :P

But seriously, that is a very good point. 15 seems to be a magical age for a lot of skaters. :watch: