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jlai
09-06-2010, 01:26 AM
jgp final qualifiers deserve a bye. They earn them.

GP byes are tricky. On one hand, it's too much to compete at 2 gps and do regionals and/or sectionals, but once in a while, people gripe over skaters who get gp slots --and therefore earning a bye--when their results aren't so spectacular,so we don't know if they would have made it out of their sectionals.



I can't recall a situation in which a skater earned their GP bye after not qualifying. Let's hope we don't have to find out!


There's that situation with Megan Oster, but she withdrew from both GPs after not qualifying for regionals. I remember much talk about that, and a lot of discussion about Emily Hughes another year doing gps and earning byes after doing rather poorly at regionals one year. And also last year, should Meissner get a bye to nationals after not competing at nationals the year before? She eventually lost the bye, but the rule would have allowed her to compete in Spokane had she done her gp. In cases like this, it should be either bye all the way (because that gp withdrawal eventually cost her the spot at nationals) or no bye at all (making her prove herself from the getgo).

pinky166
09-06-2010, 02:18 AM
Didn't the USFSA send Emily to Skate America last year because they knew there was a good chance she wouldn't get out of sectionals considering the score she put up at regionals? But it would be good for rankings if she competed at nationals where she is a former Olympian, and rankings/drama matter I guess.

Nomad
09-06-2010, 02:52 AM
I think her score at Regionals (139+) would have put her in 3rd place at Sectionals. She only scored about a point higher at Nats (140+). Both of which were slightly better than her score at SA (135+). Not sure what you mean about rankings, though.

chipso1
09-06-2010, 04:05 AM
GP byes are tricky. On one hand, it's too much to compete at 2 gps and do regionals and/or sectionals, but once in a while, people gripe over skaters who get gp slots --and therefore earning a bye--when their results aren't so spectacular,so we don't know if they would have made it out of their sectionals.

I see what you're saying, but IMO, if a skater is good enough, has earned a spot or has been chosen to represent the U.S. on the Grand Prix series, they're worthy of a direct bye to Nationals. I know it can get tricky with people withdrawing from GP events at the last minute, but that's more of the exception rather than the rule.

pinky166
09-06-2010, 04:09 AM
I think her score at Regionals (139+) would have put her in 3rd place at Sectionals. She only scored about a point higher at Nats (140+). Both of which were slightly better than her score at SA (135+). Not sure what you mean about rankings, though.

I just meant it would add to the intensity/drama if Emily was at nationals where she had already gone to the Olympics and was making a "comeback".

Polymer Bob
09-06-2010, 02:23 PM
Perhaps you mean "ratings", not "rankings". :)

Sylvia
09-06-2010, 03:49 PM
Vanessa Lam, who turned 15 in June and was 8th in Junior at 2010 U.S. Nationals, won the Senior Ladies event at the Golden West club competition this past weekend with a total score of 158.19, which happens to be the second highest score this summer.

For those who like to keep track of summer competition scores ;), here is the current Top Ten:
Christina Gao 159.07 (Skate Detroit) - bye to Nationals
Vanessa Lam 158.19 (Golden West) - SWP
Kristiene Gong 153.92 (Glacier Falls) - SWP
Agnes Zawadzki 153.82 (Liberty) - SW; bye through Mids to Nationals
Ashley Wagner 153.17 (Skate Wilmington) - bye to Nationals
Rachael Flatt 149.33 (Glacier Falls) - bye to Nationals
Samantha Cesario 147.26 (Liberty) - NA
Lindsay Davis 135.77 (Glacier Falls) - SWP
Karen Zhou 135.03 (US Collegiates) - SWP
Yasmin Siraj 131.48 (Liberty) - NE

The Southwest Pacific (SWP) region is shaping up to be the deepest/most competitive of the 9 Regionals for Senior ladies this October.

jlai
09-06-2010, 04:23 PM
I see what you're saying, but IMO, if a skater is good enough, has earned a spot or has been chosen to represent the U.S. on the Grand Prix series, they're worthy of a direct bye to Nationals. I know it can get tricky with people withdrawing from GP events at the last minute, but that's more of the exception rather than the rule.

Theoretically I think skaters with 2 gps should get a bye, but USFSA doesn't seem to require good summer monitoring as a condition for fall assignments, so we occasionally end up with gp skaters who get byes but have rather poor international performances. Then fans grumble. Perhaps a stricter monitoring system could take care of that?

I also wonder about skaters like Carriere. He competes at SA, so he gets a sectional bye right? Yet he withdrew from last year's nationals, so in a way, the ISU assignments are "dictating" to an extent who gets to compete at US nationals. Not sure if there's a way around that though.

pinky166
09-06-2010, 05:48 PM
Vanessa Lam, who turned 15 in June and was 8th in Junior at 2010 U.S. Nationals, won the Senior Ladies event at the Golden West club competition this past weekend with a total score of 158.19, which happens to be the second highest score this summer.

For those who like to keep track of summer competition scores ;), here is the current Top Ten:
Christina Gao 159.07 (Skate Detroit) - bye to Nationals
Vanessa Lam 158.19 (Golden West) - SWP
Kristiene Gong 153.92 (Glacier Falls) - SWP
Agnes Zawadzki 153.82 (Liberty) - SW; bye through Mids to Nationals
Ashley Wagner 153.17 (Skate Wilmington) - bye to Nationals
Rachael Flatt 149.33 (Glacier Falls) - bye to Nationals
Samantha Cesario 147.26 (Liberty) - NA
Lindsay Davis 135.77 (Glacier Falls) - SWP
Karen Zhou 135.03 (US Collegiates) - SWP
Yasmin Siraj 131.48 (Liberty) - NE

The Southwest Pacific (SWP) region is shaping up to be the deepest/most competitive of the 9 Regionals for Senior ladies this October.

What did I tell people about Christina? It seems to me that she is living up to her hype, and what's better is that score she posted was at the very beginning of the summer and she achieved it without using all her jumping passes (she did two combos only, and each one only had 2 jumps, had she done another 3 jump combo her score would have been even higher) :)

Sylvia
09-06-2010, 05:54 PM
What did I tell people about Christina? It seems to me that she is living up to her hype,
You mean YOUR hype? ;) Some fans like to hype the younger generation of skaters, while other fans, like me, prefer to take a "wait-and-see" attitude as the season progresses. I am pleased to see Christina Gao's improvements in her skating so far this summer, and am really looking forward to seeing how she does at her first international (JGP Austria) in 2 weeks.

(jlai, yes re. Carriere. I've listed the known sectional byes in the Senior Men's thread: http://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/showpost.php?p=2866718&postcount=29 )

ETA:

Theoretically I think skaters with 2 gps should get a bye, but USFSA doesn't seem to require good summer monitoring as a condition for fall assignments, so we occasionally end up with gp skaters who get byes but have rather poor international performances. Then fans grumble. Perhaps a stricter monitoring system could take care of that?
But I don't think a "stricter monitoring system" by USFS in the summer should result in Grand Prix assignments (which are based primarily on the previous season's international results) being taken away from skaters? USFS can only control which U.S. skaters are assigned to Skate America, and at least they have been leaving SA TBA spots open to reward skaters/teams that monitor well in the summer.

haribobo
09-06-2010, 07:23 PM
What did I tell people about Christina? It seems to me that she is living up to her hype

Yes, all hail the might pinky. You are sooooo amazing and prognostic! Please pinky, tell us the sekret of your ways? :rolleyes:

gracieboo
09-06-2010, 07:29 PM
What did I tell people about Christina? It seems to me that she is living up to her hype, and what's better is that score she posted was at the very beginning of the summer and she achieved it without using all her jumping passes (she did two combos only, and each one only had 2 jumps, had she done another 3 jump combo her score would have been even higher) :)

Vanessa had a fall in the short and two falls in the long and still received the highest score in the competition by over 44 points. Her artistry has immensely improved from what I saw last season.

http://allyearfsc.com/events/GOLDEN_WEST/2010gwresults/SeniorLadiesFS.HTM

does anyone have a link to Gao's program? I would love to see her new program! :)

jlai
09-06-2010, 07:49 PM
But I don't think a "stricter monitoring system" by USFS in the summer should result in Grand Prix assignments (which are based primarily on the previous season's international results) being taken away from skaters? USFS can only control which U.S. skaters are assigned to Skate America, and at least they have been leaving SA TBA spots open to reward skaters/teams that monitor well in the summer.

As I said, there's no good way around the issue, as the byes due to GP assignments are shaping the US nationals competitor list and are not completely within USFSA control. (Which I think is a bit weird. USFSA should have complete control over who compete at their own nationals to make sure the best get there.)

The only things I can think of is 1) closer monitoring prior to international assignments and 2) being more stringent with byes. Or a combination of both.

ETA: Here's another thought: USFS could spread out the sectionals through two weekends, so a lower-ranked skater going to, say, Skate America, will still go to a sectionals the weekend before or after (eta: if that skater does poorly in the gp, say 10th, 11th or sth). In those cases, that skater isn't required to be in any skating club within that region. That would be a drastic reform of the regional/sectionals/bye system though.

pinky166
09-06-2010, 07:52 PM
Vanessa had a fall in the short and two falls in the long and still received the highest score in the competition by over 44 points. Her artistry has immensely improved from what I saw last season.

http://allyearfsc.com/events/GOLDEN_WEST/2010gwresults/SeniorLadiesFS.HTM

does anyone have a link to Gao's program? I would love to see her new program! :)

SP: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qldotckIovU
FS: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FMsz50dW9JI&feature=related
:)

pinky166
09-06-2010, 07:55 PM
Yes, all hail the might pinky. You are sooooo amazing and prognostic! Please pinky, tell us the sekret of your ways? :rolleyes:

Well, my predictions about nationals and the Olympics actually turned out to be correct - Mirai going, Sasha not going, Alissa bombing, Christina beating Caroline....:P

Further, I've seen Christina skate live, so that makes a difference.