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numbers123
05-05-2010, 03:03 PM
as someone who hasn't attended SOI for 4 years and the previous COI for nearly 8 years, the addition of Johnny to any cast would not have taken me away from IN or other media outlets for competitive skating to see.

SOI is a business. Businesses can choose who they want to represent them - hello, hiring/firing process anyone? - and in this case chose not to hire Johnny. Whatever the reasons are, he and his fans are not helping the resume/marketability to be hired by anyone else.

IF he thinks he has been unfairly rejected as an employee, make the proper appeals. Discrimation laws exist, but I don't think that can be proven here.

Yazmeen
05-05-2010, 05:30 PM
This all makes sense. But why WASN'T Johnny invited? :confused:

My guess is that it was a twofold combination of lack of stellar skating results/placements over the past couple of years (compared to Evan's Olympic and World Championships and Jeremy's two National Championships) in a cast already heavy with male skaters and his penchant for getting attention for everything over his skating and this includes his penchant for celebrity and fame. Scott Hamilton favors team players, not individuals who stand out for things beside their skating skills.

Nan
05-05-2010, 05:39 PM
Scott Hamilton favors team players, not individuals who stand out for things beside their skating skills.

And I might also guess that he doesn't care for skaters who stand out enough to overshadow the attention he thinks he deserves. ;)

jlai
05-05-2010, 05:55 PM
But why WASN'T Johnny invited? :confused:

Unless both sides speak freely, you won't get the true answer. But you'll get a sense here what each FSUer's world view is based on their opinions. :)

Debbie S
05-05-2010, 05:56 PM
Don't worry; I'm sure the book will show up in the Bargain Bins and flea market tables pretty quickly, just like Tonya Harding's and Jon Jackson's did. Great literature, it ain't gonna be.


Yeah. I hope he's not counting on his royalties to keep him in the lifestyle he wishes to obtain. :lol:Well, a book doesn't need to be great literature to earn a lot of royalties. ;)

But I agree that I'll probably read more from the book on FSU than I would ever want to pay for.


My guess is that it was a twofold combination of lack of stellar skating results/placements over the past couple of years (compared to Evan's Olympic and World Championships and Jeremy's two National Championships) in a cast already heavy with male skaters and his penchant for getting attention for everything over his skating and this includes his penchant for celebrity and fame. Scott Hamilton favors team players, not individuals who stand out for things beside their skating skills.Yes, exactly!

jlai
05-05-2010, 06:20 PM
I'm sure the book will show up in the Bargain Bins

Don't you know who I am? :mad:
Remember my name
(Weir)
I'm gonna live forever
I'm gonna learn how to fly
(High)
I feel it coming together
People will see me and cry

:)

Wyliefan
05-05-2010, 06:23 PM
And I might also guess that he doesn't care for skaters who stand out enough to overshadow the attention he thinks he deserves. ;)

Right, because Scott's image was EVERYWHERE when I went to see it. His life-size statue was paraded around the ice before, during, and after the show, and you couldn't even pass through the doors without first bowing to the ten-foot poster of Dear Leader on the wall.

:lol:

Let's be serious. As much hate as Scott draws on this board, for whatever reason, he's been quite willing to seek attention for other skaters and not just himself.

BlueRidge
05-05-2010, 06:31 PM
Right, because Scott's image was EVERYWHERE when I went to see it. His life-size statue was paraded around the ice before, during, and after the show, and you couldn't even pass through the doors without first bowing to the ten-foot poster of Dear Leader on the wall.



Yes it was just frightening! :rofl:

I don't recall any reference whatsoever to Scott anywhere at the show. I do think that he doesn't want anyone to overshadow the whole show... but that would only explain why it doesn't have Michelle Kwan... ;)

aftershocks
05-05-2010, 06:34 PM
Lots of fodder in the offseason. Fun to read all the opinions, the jokes and the asides. Lots of good copywriters here.

All joking aside (pun intended)..., as I recall from earlier reports, some unidentified spokesperson affiliated (?) with IMG leaked to the press that the reason Johnny was not asked to tour with SOI is because he's not "family friendly." Then this "family friendly" reasoning was tied to the sponsor, again through leaked IMG comments. Johnny had no part in any of this until the "family friendly" comment was brought to his attention by the media. When he was asked about not being "family friendly" that's when he commented, and in fact he downplayed the whole thing about not being asked because as he's repeatedly said, he's never been invited to tour with SOI, and didn't expect to be asked after the Olympics. It was the claim that he's not "family friendly" that irked Johnny, and indeed had a lot of skating fans scratching their heads. Based on this recent SOI number, I guess Adam Lambert is loads more "family friendly" than Johnny Weir.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KfK6l6CPqeE&feature=PlayList&p=4A19F1EC2EA73B16&playnext_from=PL&playnext=1&index=73


For the poster who asked for details about the faux Johnny/ Evan war:

http://greginhollywood.com/johnny-weir-labels-evan-lysacek-a-slore-26923

In my opinion, the real war is between figure skating PTB and their abject and antiquated fear of male skaters appearing to be "skating while gay," despite the fact as everyone knows many coaches, many skaters, many officials are gay, and some perhaps bi, and even straight too. And, slap my hand for even mentioning that there may in fact even be some lesbians out there on the ice. Pardon me, what century are we living in???

Johnny and Evan are just casualties of this war, although Evan apparently gets most of the official spoils. I think they'll both find their way and do very well in life. This whole chapter in their lives does deserve an intelligent book, written from the point of view of how it has exposed the depths of this sport's hypocrisy.

I love the sport and the skaters, and I absolutely love Frank Carroll, so I say this with all due respect. Frank is definitely the person in charge of his skaters. Kudos to Frank because while pigs couldn't fly (at least at 2010 Olympics), Frank was able to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear -- with all due credit to Evan's determined focus, and the usual politics, which obviously will forever govern this sport.

Kudos to Johnny for being a beautiful and a courageous skater and person. Whether acknowledged or not, he has been an undeniably inspirational force and presence in the sport. He even inspired Evan, and that's a fact. Keeping it real folks, and looking beyond the cockeyed surface of things..., that ain't easy. And, you know what, "he ain't heavy, he's my brother."

http://www.stlyrics.com/lyrics/zoolander/heaintheavyhesmybrother.htm

Prancer
05-05-2010, 06:37 PM
All joking aside (pun intended)..., as I recall from earlier reports, some unidentified spokesperson affiliated (?) with IMG leaked to the press that the reason Johnny was not asked to tour with SOI is because he's not "family friendly." Then this "family friendly" reasoning was tied to the sponsor, again through leaked IMG comments. Johnny had no part in any of this until the "family friendly" comment was brought to his attention by the media.

I believe that the only "family friendly leaks" have come from Johnny's agent.

I may be wrong on that, but I don't recall any other spokesperson saying anything of the kind.

WildRose
05-05-2010, 06:40 PM
And I might also guess that he doesn't care for skaters who stand out enough to overshadow the attention he thinks he deserves. ;)

LOL, Scott hasn't skated with Stars on Ice for years - I doubt he's worried about being overshadowed.

BlueRidge
05-05-2010, 06:44 PM
I believe that the only "family friendly leaks" have come from Johnny's agent.

I may be wrong on that, but I don't recall any other spokesperson saying anything of the kind.

Its part of the Johnny fan mythology now, along with "Evan has said homophobic things," and the "USFSA has tried to fcuck Johnny over for years because he's too gay appearing." Then we roll on the floor hugging ourselves weeping and moaning in the joy and pain of uberfandom. :rolleyes:

sorry, I'm more than a little sick of the bullshit of people who don't care about any evidence for anything and believe whatever is said by all their fellow ubers about the objects of their oh-so-pure and beautiful fanly desires.

Nan
05-05-2010, 06:45 PM
LOL, Scott hasn't skated with Stars on Ice for years -

Yes. I know. That's kind of the point. Gone, but never allowed to be forgotten.

kwanfan1818
05-05-2010, 06:55 PM
Whatever the reason, Johnny has fans who have been known to fly in from Japan just to watch him skate in one show.
I sat next to a group of nine or ten of young Japanese women for post-Torino COI, and they made a double double-header of the trip in Seattle -- both Everett shows and Ichiro with the Mariners -- and they were there for Weir, and they also mentioned Portland. They had signs for him, and I thought Elvis had risen from the dead from all the squealing and swooning. (One woman did have one of those mask-like signs on a stick with a beautiful cartoon of :glamor:kawa, yay!) In 2007, I was on the on other side of the arena, but saw recognized one of the cuter signs. I don't know if the same women were back, or if they passed on the signs.

I saw COI shows in several west coast cities, and Weir was among the top two or three in ovations each time.

Anecdotal to be sure, but what isn't is that his fan clubs are more geographically distributed and organized than many of the other US skaters, and they rally around him. Also, I've never heard that he is anything but gracious to his fans, which keeps the cycle going, unlike a certain headliner who I witnessed trying to sneak out of a CSOI pre-performance practice without meeting the TV sponsor's contest-winning guests...


as someone who hasn't attended SOI for 4 years and the previous COI for nearly 8 years, the addition of Johnny to any cast would not have taken me away from IN or other media outlets for competitive skating to see.
Whereas for me it was the opposite. I wasn't about to subject myself to another year of Weiss and Eldredge for a glimpse of Yuka Sato and was planning not to go, especially since I now live in a CSOI city, but, thankfully, LadyNit told me I had missed Davis/White on the Seattle roster, and they were enough of a draw for me to make the trip down.


This all makes sense. But why WASN'T Johnny invited? :confused:
You mean then, or now?

2003 was the first time Kurt Browning's SOI history list (http://www.kurtfiles.com/soi/history.php) mentions guests, and both were former cast members, Gordeeva and Hamilton. In 2004 it was the first time they had cast members who were contracted for part of the tour (Gordeeva and Sato) and the first time a part-time guest, Michael Weiss, had not been on the tour before. In 2007 they expanded again to 11 in the main cast, with Gordeeva and Nikodinov splitting cities, and five guests, former cast members Kulik and Browning, and then Cohen, Hughes, and Meissner; the women guests got the men/women ratio into better balance.

In 2008, the first year of the merger, the roster was one of the smaller ones -- 8 regular acts -- with two guests, Kulik (:cheer2:) and Sale/Pelletier. There were three women on the regular roster -- Cohen, Robinson, and Sato -- and two men -- Weiss and Eldredge (who was not yet phoning it in) -- and Kulik for half the shows. They were a smaller roster, and, they were anything but top heavy with men.

The SOI press announcement (http://www.scottradecenter.com/STC-events/starsonice.html) that Cohen was joining the cast plugs Shen/Zhao as "two-time Olympic Bronze Medalists", not as World Champions, and Ina/Zimmerman as "World Bronze Medalists", not US Champions, which suggests that bronze at the international championship level is shiny enough for them.

Weir was contracted to COI through the 2007 tour. 2008 was the year Weir lost a tie-breaker for the US National Championship, something that was widely discussed by fans, if not casual viewers, and he was the only US medalist at Worlds. 2008 would have been the obvious time to invite him for some post-Worlds guest appearances.

Weir wrote in his April 2008 blog entry (http://www.figureskatersonline.com/johnnyweir/journalmain.php?p=08april.php) that he had three firm post-Worlds touring commitments, two in Japan and one in Skokie, but was reviewing other offers. He wrote "I wish I was performing more in the U.S but at this point it looks like it could be three shows tops for this touring season." Whether this meant "No one else in the US asked me" or "Sorry, suckers, I turned down SOI to skate in Bratislava" isn't clear from the statement, but I'm assuming the former, since it would have been very easy for SOI, when asked about Weir this year, to have said, "We've asked him in the past, but he was busy" if the latter were true. In his July 2008 entry (http://www.figureskatersonline.com/johnnyweir/journalmain.php?p=08july.php) he noted a robust touring schedule, including with Plushenko.

By 2009, Weir was off the National podium, although he was reigning World Bronze Medalist, at least through LA, plus he was free after January :saint:. The cast was balanced between men and women (three each), and there were four guests, Belbin/Agosto, Meissner, Buttle, and Lysacek.

Do I think that Smuckers didn't want him hired in 2008 or for guest appearances in 2010? Do I think that USFS was unhappy about Weir being the only US medalist in 2008 and that the 7th place finisher at US Nationals would have been preferable? Yes and yes. Can I prove it? No and no.

That was then. As for now, had Weir replied with "never asked" or "ask them", it is possible that he would have been one of the skaters added later for a few performances, especially on the West Coast, which is a straightforward trip from Asia; Vancouver, a big destination for young Japanese tourists, is only several hours away from Seattle by bus or train, Portland several more, and Ichiro is still playing for the M's (:cheer2: :respec:). Both sides had face-saving stories in Mr. Weir's busy touring schedule ("It took a while to arrange"), he could have dropped in, done his solos, been on the bus for a week or so, and not have had to be part of the group numbers, all of which sounds win/win to me.

Once he accused the sponsors of discrimination, it was Game Over. That he didn't have the balls to stick with his story made him lose my respect.

aftershocks
05-05-2010, 06:59 PM
Yes it was just frightening! :rofl:

I don't recall any reference whatsoever to Scott anywhere at the show. I do think that he doesn't want anyone to overshadow the whole show... but that would only explain why it doesn't have Michelle Kwan... ;)

Ahhhh... the Ambassador. Guess she's too busy going to graduate school and flying to other countries trying to improve/rescue our reputation with the rest of the world. Pity she can't save figure skating's reputation, or SOI's for that matter.

BTW, I don't think it's a secret that Scott Hamilton has asked/ wished for/ wanted Michelle Kwan to skate with SOI. If the Kween did find the time to skate in a few appearances, I'd bet anything it would improve ticket sales in those venues.