Mao News !

[MikiAndoFan#1]

If she didn't unleash it at the Olympics when a medal was on the line, what makes you think she will want to unleash it again next season?

It isn't about whether she can do it or not. It's about whether, according to her and Morosov, it is strategically smart to try it. It's been so long since she has one ratified, because the calling has become stricter, and also because of her own problems with rotations. She is getting less height on the flip too and is lucky the one at Worlds got ratified.

If she is to bring a 3/3 to Worlds I bet it's going to be a 3/3toe. I personally think she will just stick with the 2axel3toe for the coming years. An Olympic medal is no longer possible, and she already has a World title. If she wants to continue for 4 more years it would just be fpr the same reason why Suguri is doing it post-2006.

And what makes you think she wouldn't want to unleash it?

:rolleyes:

Her 3Lz+3Lo only needs more consistency on it, which it has lost in the past season. Miki was skating rather slow last season, another reason for her unsuccessful attempts. She also was too nervous in competitions, she tried too hard not to make mistakes, she was conservative. But she'll bring it next season!

:cheer2:

[wonderlen]

Miki knows she have to nail the 3Lz+3Lo. Her clean SP @ best only get around 66-67 range so if she play it safe with 3+2 she will still be in 4th spot at best around 68 range. She knows she wouldnot going to get the PCS mark like Kim, Asada or Rochett so she needs the TES cushion. Juding from the PCS mark in the SP, the judges are pretty much already selected the three skaters for the podium just like in Torino.

[key65man]

I think it's a bit harsh to say Miki isn't capable of successfully landing the 3Lz+3Lo in competition anymore. Just because she left it out of her programs last season doesn't mean she can't do it in competition. She was unsuccessfull with her two attempts last season, but mainly because of lack of speed going into the combination, etc. I'm sure she'll bring it next season.

Sasha, when she was working on 4S, could make it one out of 5 tries in practice as I heard. Had she tried it in every competition, she would eventually have made it. If so, I guess you can say she could do 4S because technically it is true. But, my criterion is consistency when it comes to “being able to do a jump.”

You are technically right that Miki can do 3Lz-3Lo and may get it eventually if she tries it frequently enough.

[key65man]

This I agree. (And yes I am alive and well :D ) However, I also think that fixing one jump (flip/lutz) can affect other jumps as well. I think fixing her flutz a season ago has affected her other jumps, especially her flip which looks kinda weird now. This directly affects her combos which all have flip as the first jump. I think if she reworks her flip jump, it may be possible for her to get the consistency she once had in her combos. Of course, this is not an easy task but it also depends on the new technical coach Mao gets in the future.

Technically, Mao's Flip is not a Flip though she gets it ratified as one. Flip is supposed to take advantage of a turn, Mohawk in her case, and its momentum. But, Mao glides after the turn, which essentially kills the momentum from the turn. There is no consensus, I think, about being true to the mechanism for deduction. So, Mao will be fine as long as she jumps on the inside edge. But, not being able to take advantage of the turn is one of the reasons, I assume, that she does not get enough energy to make 3F-3.

But, you must consider why she does Flip in the way she does in the first place. One, she may have a trouble keeping the jump edge when she is true to the Flip mechanism. Or, she may have a problem dealing with the more energy from the turn (after all, the reason she slows down before jump is to increase consistency by essentially reducing the energy from speed). I have no idea which is the case with her Flip. Either way, she is not going to make her 3F more powerful without risking consistency (on correct jump edge and/or actually landing it), I doubt.

[key65man]

This I agree. (And yes I am alive and well :D ) However, I also think that fixing one jump (flip/lutz) can affect other jumps as well. I think fixing her flutz a season ago has affected her other jumps, especially her flip which looks kinda weird now. This directly affects her combos which all have flip as the first jump. I think if she reworks her flip jump, it may be possible for her to get the consistency she once had in her combos. Of course, this is not an easy task but it also depends on the new technical coach Mao gets in the future.

For the second jump (of 3F-3 or whatever 3-3 combinations), 3Lo is almst out of the question for Mao in my opinion. 3Lo as the second jump in a combination is generally considered as one of the most difficult jumps. Unless you make a perfect first jump and preserve enough energy from it for the second jump, it requires a monsterously powerful leg to make it. Most men cannot make it without under-rotating it.

3T is a better candidate for Mao as a second jump. Mao has a minor issue with Toeloop. I am sure, however, she may find 3T easier for a second triple jump with an adjustment. (In my opinion, 3T-3T would be a better combo to start with although she will up it to 3F-3T later on, but I am sure many would disagree)

I guess Mao can make 3F-3 if she tries hard enough and frequently enough in competitions. She may get it ratified more frequently as UR judging is politically sensitive. But, if her goal is Sochi, she should not rely on “ratification” despite of her jump being under-rotated technically because they will crack down on under-rotation -- quite diff from what happened in Vancouver -- if Russia has a legit shot at gold with their kids solid on jumps.

Mao should have a repertoire of core jumps that are not as subject to under-rotation and therefore not at mercy of political tic-tac-toe. Making Lutz and Salchow consistent, therefore, should be her priority, I think.

[key65man]

This I agree. (And yes I am alive and well :D ) However, I also think that fixing one jump (flip/lutz) can affect other jumps as well. I think fixing her flutz a season ago has affected her other jumps, especially her flip which looks kinda weird now. This directly affects her combos which all have flip as the first jump. I think if she reworks her flip jump, it may be possible for her to get the consistency she once had in her combos. Of course, this is not an easy task but it also depends on the new technical coach Mao gets in the future.

BTW, I agree that fixing flutz can affect Flip. The two are completely different mechanism-wise. Learning one mechanism may affect the other. However, it is a matter of time and patience to fix flutz or relearn Lutz, I believe, although some say it is impossible to fix flutz without affecting the Flip.

[miki88]

Technically, Mao's Flip is not a Flip though she gets it ratified as one. Flip is supposed to take advantage of a turn, Mohawk in her case, and its momentum. But, Mao glides after the turn, which essentially kills the momentum from the turn. There is no consensus, I think, about being true to the mechanism for deduction. So, Mao will be fine as long as she jumps on the inside edge. But, not being able to take advantage of the turn is one of the reasons, I assume, that she does not get enough energy to make 3F-3.

But, you must consider why she does Flip in the way she does in the first place. One, she may have a trouble keeping the jump edge when she is true to the Flip mechanism. Or, she may have a problem dealing with the more energy from the turn (after all, the reason she slows down before jump is to increase consistency by essentially reducing the energy from speed). I have no idea which is the case with her Flip. Either way, she is not going to make her 3F more powerful without risking consistency (on correct jump edge and/or actually landing it), I doubt.

Maybe Mao and TAT was trying to make her flip more powerful or else I don't get why they tweaked with it. It definitely looks different from before. The entrance to her flip was not that long before. And since Mao's flip was quite inconsistent earlier this season that could point to the side effects of fixing a jump. And then to make it more consistent, she went back to older methods perhaps? Similar thing happened to her lutz. I agree that reworking jumps take a long time and it's tricky because the skater almost have to risk consistency and perhaps results in the short term for long term success and for a top skater like Mao it's a hard decision.

[key65man]

Maybe Mao and TAT was trying to make her flip more powerful or else I don't get why they tweaked with it. It definitely looks different from before. The entrance to her flip was not that long before. And since Mao's flip was quite inconsistent earlier this season that could point to the side effects of fixing a jump. And then to make it more consistent, she went back to older methods perhaps? Similar thing happened to her lutz. I agree that reworking jumps take a long time and it's tricky because the skater almost have to risk consistency and perhaps results in the short term for long term success and for a top skater like Mao it's a hard decision.

I am not sure exactly what had happened with Mao and Tarasova. But, I doubt the long glide after the turn was to make Flip more powerful. The longer the glide, the slower one gets. And, you get more time to prepare for the jump. There may be other reasons for the long glide. But, it is safe to assume that it is to establish consistency in jump edge and/or landing (assuming no under-rotation).

I think the weight loss was bigger a factor for Mao's consistency. But, it is possible that fixing Lutz might have contributed to the inconsistency. Only she and her coaches (and her mom) know this for sure. So....

I agree that it is a very difficult decision for Mao to assume the risk. And, it is not just her decision. A lot have been built around Mao as I am sure you would agree. If Mao falls out of grace for a year or two, I am not sure what may transpire with all the build-ups around her. So, the new team will soon have to make a tough decision wisely by negotiating long term goals and short term whatnot.

[Japanfan]

It's very good new for Mao that the ISU is considering allowing the 3A in the Ladies' SP. I'm assuming the proposed change will pass.

What is Mao's best strategy for the SP?

Should she do the 3A/2A and replace the 2A with a third triple. I gather that she doesn't have a consistent 3 lutz or sal, so would need to do two of 3T, Loop or Flip?

Or should she do the 3A by itself and add a 3-2 or 3-3 combo? I gather that her best chance is a 3T3T?

[tarotx]

She should do the 3A as the required axel so she doesn't have to worry about a downgrade as much. I think she should abandoned the triple axel combo and work on a 3-3.

I think she should do:

3A
3f-3toe
3l out of steps

That would give her a potential to have 4 triples in the short but if she only does a double axle and/or 2toe (downgrade, pop, being careful) it won't be as devastating in her score which should allow her to be less tight and allow the program to sing.

[MikiAndoFan#1]

Since Mao loves the Loop, I say she should go for:

3A
3Lo+3Lo
3F

:cheer2:

[loulou]

Since Mao loves the Loop, I say she should go for:

3Lo+3Lo

:cheer2:

And I'm afraid that second 3Lo wouldn't get ratified.

I agree with posters above that her best chances are

3A
3F+3T
3Lo