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wnstnluv
01-17-2010, 08:29 PM
The best story I can relate is the first time I met Johnny was after a show at the Ice Vault. I was so nervous all I could do was stammer out a few words and ask for a photo. My son took the picture but when I walked away to check the photo, I discovered that my son had cut off mine and Johnny's heads. Johnny saw me checking the picture, came over to me and asked me if the photo came out okay. When I said no, he offered to pose for the camera again. He didn't have to do that, he could had just continued to pose for photos and sign autographs for the others who were waiting but he didn't and that is the Johnny I will always remember.

Very cool story. Thanks for sharing it :)


Everything you said

:respec:

Karpenko
01-17-2010, 11:31 PM
I view his more "outrageous" or colorful persona as more of a marketing decision than anything else, much the same way contestants on a reality show play up certain aspects of their personality to get more attention on the show and in the future on other shows or in the media. Although this often backfires for reality show contestants, sometimes it works in their favor, and it has worked for Johnny insofar as it got him a documentary and his own reality show series.

Is it "fake" or is it really him? I don't know, and I don't know that it really matters. Don't we all act differently depending on the context we're in? For instance, I'll act one way around my parents, another way around my boss, another way around my coworkers, another way around my friends, etc., and none of them are exactly fake, just different aspects of myself; Johnny's persona is just an amplified variation on that, IMO.



He could succumb to his nerves, as he has done since his Olympic LP in 2006, but I don't think he will today, I hope--he's very well-trained and in a position to skate well; he's acknowledged that he leaves out combos, so I hope he'll put them all in today.

And while I hate his short program music, I can't fault him for choosing Ennio Morricone (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ennio_Morricone), among other music, for his long. No, Morricone isn't Saint-Saens, but he's well-respected among many. And Johnny is hardly the only one to have questionable music choice, unfortunately--why must so many skate to Mvrica?

Very good points here, I'm the same way. You don't show every aspect of your personality to every person you know, unless its your boyfriend or something.

I do agree with poths to an extent though. I think the past few years Johnny has showed with his actions that he doesn't care about skating as much as he did before Torino. This year its much different and he's doing well, but there is a lack of competitive fight in him that his words don't add up with a lot of the time.

The combos thing for example is just so careless. An extra double toe loop isn't going to throw off everybodies perception of your entire program, being, soul, and holy spirit. :rolleyes:

For so long, if I were in his position I would be trying to muster every single thing out of my career, especially with his talent. Which he has, he's been very successful, but that killer instinct competitiveness has always been something I wish he had more of.

I think at some point after 2006 it became less about his passion for skating, and more about the passion for the opportunites that his life in skating can bring him.

At any rate his skating is now at a beautiful, polished place again, but he still needs to get a lot more competitive fire IMO. I definitely wish him nothing but the best because I've always really liked him, but there are certain things about him that have always annoyed me to no end. He really should be a multiple World champion by now, but all in all he's still always fun to watch and interesting.

igniculus
01-18-2010, 12:03 AM
I think at some point after 2006 it became less about his passion for skating, and more about the passion for the opportunites that his life in skating can bring him.

I very much agree with this. And one should care about future, especially when he is not invited to so many shows, or to SOI, that would have him for years in skating and could establish him a financial safety.

But on the other hand, if you're a skater, and talk about how hard you work, and you want to show people in documentaries all your work, then you really should demonstrate it on the ice too. I mentioned at a different board that his SP looked very nervous and cautious, and I got :lynch: by his fans. BUT IT DID. And now that I've seen his LP, there is NO WAY I'd agree with him or Galina that "he never was more confident in himself or in his programs". He was very reserved in the SP, and terrified in the LP. I believe he works hard, and the team wants his best, but this is not the Johnny Weir anymore people fell in love with five or six years ago. (with his skating, I mean)


He really should be a multiple World champion by now, but all in all he's still always fun to watch and interesting.

By his talent, yes.
I'll be curious about people's opinions about Pop Star on Ice, because there, Priscilla has some very touching comments on Johnny when they broke up. She really summarized the essence of liking Johnny Weir, and what made people appreciating his skating and talent. I think Johnny never really realized how talented he was and what he could have reached in this sport, either because fame, money and recognition overshadowed his eyes, or because nobody really told him that to his heart directly. He gets commented on how amazing, gorgeous, etc. he is, he gets such a support from his fans and family. But if someone would have said to him: "Listen, boy. You may be young and reckless and want to be rich and famous and live in a glamor. But thing is, you have a talent that is probably born every 100 years. So it's time now to decide what you want to do with your life. Do you think money, fashion, or documentaries are worth anything when you could go down in history as the greatest male skater of all time?"... it would make the world of difference. Priscilla has always known and seen the talent in Johnny. She may have not been the best coach to bring it out of him. But she saw that THING in him that could have made him into the finest skater of the modern era. And it was incredibly hard for her to let it go. To see this talent getting wasted.

You know, people praise Johnny for being himself and not allowing other to change him, not listening to criticism, etc. You know what? I don't. Because when others comment your work, not every word is intended as hurtful. There are people who will always try to improve you with their intentions, and this is something Johnny never realized. He always thought people hate him like he was and thus they wanted him to change, so he never succumbed to that. This is probably my biggest dissappointment in being a Johnny Weir fan.

libby
01-18-2010, 12:08 AM
I definitely do not think Johnny's so-called "outrageous" personality is a put-on for the media. I also never understand why people think that if he put on a fake, more PC personality, that it would somehow improve his skating.

I like Johnny's personality, as "out there" as he may be. And so do a lot of other people. He's interesting, he's smart, and he's funny. The last thing I want him to do is start spouting the USFS-approved phrases we hear from too many other guys.

There is room in this sport for a big personality. Faking a duller one wouldn't help Johnny deal with his nerves on ice, which is what holds him back.

hailstorm
01-18-2010, 12:45 AM
But on the other hand, if you're a skater, and talk about how hard you work, and you want to show people in documentaries all your work, then you really should demonstrate it on the ice too. I mentioned at a different board that his SP looked very nervous and cautious, and I got :lynch: by his fans. BUT IT DID. And now that I've seen his LP, there is NO WAY I'd agree with him or Galina that "he never was more confident in himself or in his programs". He was very reserved in the SP, and terrified in the LP. I believe he works hard, and the team wants his best, but this is not the Johnny Weir anymore people fell in love with five or six years ago. (with his skating, I mean)


I think it's very hard, though, to always demonstrate your hard work in practice on the ice, no matter how much you might want to, when you have competition nerves as Johnny has had off-and-on since the last Olympics. I absolutely believe Galina--he's probably that way in practice--but mentally he can't always bring it.

And how many can? Abbott had a beautiful, sublime performance tonight, but lost to Weir twice earlier this season. Not because Abbott doesn't work hard, but because he doesn't always have it together mentally.

And Evan has made enormous strides in his consistency, and yet look what happened tonight.

The Plushenkos, Yagudins, and Kwans of the world are very rare, and even they occasionally falter.


The combos thing for example is just so careless. An extra double toe loop isn't going to throw off everybodies perception of your entire program, being, soul, and holy spirit. :rolleyes:


LOL, true. But tonight he went for the three combos, and I'm sure his second combo would have been three jumps had he not botched the second jump. He's slow to change in this area, but he's doing it. And it's not as if others haven't had trouble with COP math (Oda, anyone?).

Yes, he could have been a world champion or medalist many times before, and now that he's older and his body is wearing out a bit, it's harder. Will he be able to overcome his nerves at this Olympic Games and skate well? I don't know, but I just can't abandon him--I'll continue to root for him all the way, and his journey, no matter how it ends, has been a fascinating one.

igniculus
01-18-2010, 12:58 AM
The Plushenkos, Yagudins, and Kwans of the world are very rare, and even they occasionally falter.


We may never know what could have become of him if just listened to 10% of the advices he got during his carrier.

pairsskater
01-18-2010, 01:01 AM
Not in the least. :slinkaway

Have you (plural) met Johnny? He is sweet...regardless of whether you love his skating or not, he's a nice person. At least he is to his fans, and that has led to good lasting impressions of him.

Allskate
01-18-2010, 01:13 AM
When I watched and praised the recent ESPN interview, I was so touched by the "normal" Johnny there (despite what people think about getting pedicure and manicure in such a :glamor: studio). The calmness in his voice and reasoning was so appealing that I wish he'd act more like that. Because it brings his persona so much closer to a viewer, you get the "aww, he is just like everyone else, one of us" feeling. But maybe he does not want to be percieved that way. :(

But Johnny doesn't decide which things people are going to choose to write about or how people are going to edit what he says. I suspect that Johnny says plenty of mild-mannered things that never get reported. I also think that much of the more outrageous things he says are reactions to what people are saying and doing.

I don't think he likes being told to be PC and I suspect that there are things that have been said to him behind the scenes that he finds offensive and those kings of things just push him to be outrageous with the media.

It's like with PETA. I don't think he started out trying to make a big deal out of the fur thing, but PETA ticked him off and now he's playing with them. (I'm anti-fur and even I find PETA obnoxious.)

Just because Johnny enjoys some of the opportunities his success brought him doesn't mean he doesn't have a passion for skating. And just because he worries what the judges will do at Nationals doesn't mean he isn't confident about the quality of his skating. He has taken strides to adapt to the COP even though it is contrary to what is natural for him. And to me he clearly seems to have matured.

In any event, I'm incredibly happy and relieved that Johnny has made the team.

Gil-Galad
01-18-2010, 01:17 AM
I so don't give a hoot about his personality, for all I care he could be eating little fluffy bunnies alive for dinner.

But his skating has seriously deteriorated (spelling? :confused:). He is not the same skater who gave us brilliant short programs from 2004 to 2006, to brilliant music. How such a classical skater can choose such insignificant and utterly boring pseudo-music again and again and again for his programs - I just don't know. I just have the feeling that he simply stopped challenging himself with different music, different choreography etc. To me, an outrageous costume (and I like those), a smooth jump here and there, plus some pretty positions - are simply not enough.

Congrats to him for making the team.

Tinami Amori
01-18-2010, 02:39 AM
Still love Weir, wish him all the Gold in skating, hope that he can over-come all that is holding him back, and expect few more master-piece programmes from him.

His programmes to me seem less interesting than before. He is not progressing artistically; his style is more reserved; his wonderful lines and movements are “cut short” and incomplete, don’t have the same flow and extention; he is not as smooth through out the whole routine as he was before. At the same time his costumes are no longer just creative, they are borderline “indecent”.

When he argued that a male skater should be allowed to wear creative, decorated, sparkly, elaborate costumes – I was on his side 100%. Now his costumes intentionally or un-intentionally scream “I am a Queen”….. and unless he is skating to the character of Freddy Mercury I don't need to know his sexual preferences during an athletic event.. even if I support Gay Rights to no end.

His SP and LP costumes this season are ridiculous…. He intentionally uses cliché elements from woman’s clothing design, corset, decolette, pinafores ……. I can easily suspect that next will come a bustle or a farthingale…… That’s too much! There is no need to make “gender statements” in an amateur competition.

All I see now is “less” in his skating quality, and “inappropriate more” in his costumes. This does not work well for me at all. If you want to be crazy-weird, first be crazy-great in the primary purpose of an event.

PEKINGMOO
01-18-2010, 02:40 AM
And Johnny is hardly the only one to have questionable music choice, unfortunately--why must so many skate to Mvrica?

It's just so Russian to skate to Mvrica.

If Plushenko or Slutskaya or Butyrskaya skated to it, so must Johnny to soak up the essence of what it means to be truly Russian...truly artistic.

The sad part is, Johnny was a gem just as he was, a pure skater, a pure technician with the ability to draw the audience in quietly. I don't think he saw or even sees, who he really is. His programs seems so blah and forced now because at his very core, I don't think he even buys this "on ice persona" he has tried to create over the past four years.

shallwedansu
01-18-2010, 02:54 AM
Heeeere's Johnny! Weir's Reality Show Making Debut (http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2010/01/17/sports/AP-OLY-FIG-US-Championships-Weir.html) (New York Times)

''It's about me,'' Weir said, a touch incredulous, when asked why people should watch it. ''No, it's a real athlete show. It's not a fluff piece, nothing is pre-scripted. ... It's the real life of what it takes to be a figure skater.''

And a fashionista and a costume designer and a guy who gives skating color (as if it needed any more).

Weir was then asked if he's hoping to get a spot on Bravo's ''Launch My Line'' show.

''I don't know that I want to be a reality show maven and go on every single one that would possibly have me,'' he said.

Ah yes, back to his show.
Figure Skater’s Campaign to Retake His Summit (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/01/18/arts/television/18weir.html) (New York Times)

One problem with “Be Good Johnny Weir,” a Sundance Channel documentary series about the efforts of Mr. Weir, the figure skater, to climb back to the top of the sport, is that it will be irrelevant by the time it has its premiere on Monday. The pivotal competition, the nationals, which the series will finally get to in March, was held over the weekend in Spokane, Wash. Anyone who cares enough about skating to watch this show will already know whether Mr. Weir did well enough to make the Olympic team, his goal.

So the real question is whether Mr. Weir’s story is compelling enough to be of interest even if he failed in his quest for one last shot at glory. (He is 25, old for a skater.) And here again there’s a problem: For people who follow the sport, Mr. Weir, flamboyant and a nonstop publicity machine, is by now overexposed.

rococo
01-18-2010, 07:02 AM
How come Johny got 3.75 from judge #8 for his transition in his SP? Can anyone explain please?
http://www.usfigureskating.org/leaderboard/results/2010/64740/results.html

yunasashafan
01-18-2010, 07:36 AM
How come Johny got 3.75 from judge #8 for his transition in his SP? Can anyone explain please?
http://www.usfigureskating.org/leaderboard/results/2010/64740/results.html

Aren't the lowest and highest scores dropped in the final score? Isn't that done specifically in order to address situations like this? Besides, didn't the same judge give Johnny 7.25 for skating skills? I take that to means that, at least in the judge's mind, there is a reason for such a low mark for transitions. Now, that does not mean that I necessarily agree with the 3.75 but to each his/her own I guess...

rococo
01-18-2010, 07:52 AM
Aren't the lowest and highest scores dropped in the final score? Isn't that done specifically in order to address situations like this? Besides, didn't the same judge give Johnny 7.25 for skating skills? I take that to means that, at least in the judge's mind, there is a reason for such a low mark for transitions. Now, that does not mean that I necessarily agree with the 3.75 but to each his/her own I guess...
Yes, it is the same judge, but there was another one who gave him 7.0 for his skating skills, who gave him 5.5 for transitions and his score stayed. In no way I am an expert, but I would say that his skating skills are a bit better than that. And I am not even his "fan". The judging in this sport is very weird. Skating skills are either there or not. How can they differ from competition to competition?