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sk9tingfan
04-21-2010, 01:28 PM
From the LA Times

Missing Johnny Weir?

Sundance Channel has the cure for your Johnny withdrawal.

The cable network is airing a one-hour special episode of "Be Good Johnny Weir," even though the season is technically over. But who can blame them? This one is going to deal specifically with the drama at the Vancouver Olympics.

A press release about the special sums it up this way: "Though Johnny skates two of his best performances ever, the judges place him behind skaters whose programs were filled with mistakes. It’s a shock to sports journalists as well as fans, and Johnny’s supporters believe that he has been 'robbed.' But the drama doesn’t end with the judging. In the face of snide and belittling media commentary about his gender, Johnny decides to tackle the issue head-on in a press conference."

In March, The Times interviewed Weir in Los Angeles. Click here and here to watch videos and listen to him talk about his feelings about the Games, among many other topics.

The special airs June 27 at 9 p.m.


--Maria Elena Fernandez (follow me

Carolla5501
04-23-2010, 02:30 AM
Did they see the same games I did? "Filled with mistakes"??? Really? FILLED??????

freezin'rinkmom
04-23-2010, 02:34 AM
From the LA Times

Missing Johnny Weir?

Sundance Channel has the cure for your Johnny withdrawal.

The cable network is airing a one-hour special episode of "Be Good Johnny Weir," even though the season is technically over. But who can blame them? This one is going to deal specifically with the drama at the Vancouver Olympics.

A press release about the special sums it up this way: "Though Johnny skates two of his best performances ever, the judges place him behind skaters whose programs were filled with mistakes. It’s a shock to sports journalists as well as fans, and Johnny’s supporters believe that he has been 'robbed.' But the drama doesn’t end with the judging. In the face of snide and belittling media commentary about his gender, Johnny decides to tackle the issue head-on in a press conference."

In March, The Times interviewed Weir in Los Angeles. Click here and here to watch videos and listen to him talk about his feelings about the Games, among many other topics.

The special airs June 27 at 9 p.m.


--Maria Elena Fernandez (follow me



Who wrote the press release (or in other words, who submitted the press release to Sundance)?

Willowway
04-23-2010, 02:41 AM
I think many people expected revisionist history here - it's been going in that direction since Vancouver. I predict (and I'm serious here) that there will come a point with Johnny and the 2010 O's where we're hearing about how he got cheated out of the gold and that he really should have had it. I don't know that it will be Johnny doing that but the show, the management - someone is going to get there, and probably sooner rather than later. And if they repeat it enough, a lot of folks who don't know skating but pay attention to the celebrity/reality TV world will believe it.

freezin'rinkmom
04-23-2010, 02:44 AM
I think many people expected revisionist history here - it's been going in that direction since Vancouver. I predict (and I'm serious here) that there will come a point with Johnny and the 2010 O's where we're hearing about how he got cheated out of the gold and that he really should have had it. I don't know that it will be Johnny doing that but the show, the management - someone is going to get there, and probably sooner rather than later. And if they repeat it enough, a lot of folks who don't know skating but pay attention to the celebrity/reality TV world will believe it.

Ditto!

Of course, all of this could quickly fade away as soon as the SGP season starts up in October! :D

hailstorm
04-23-2010, 02:45 AM
Did they see the same games I did? "Filled with mistakes"??? Really? FILLED??????

"Filled" may not be the best word...I would go with "multiple" myself. Not trying to start a debate about who should have placed higher than whom; just sayin'.

psycho
04-23-2010, 04:36 AM
Chan and Lambiel's skates were filled with mistakes. Lambiel had no 3a in the SP and one other jumping pass had negative GOE. Five elements in his FS also have negative GOE ( and considering how generously he's scored on GOE that's saying a lot!). Chan also blew a 3A in the short and made multiple mistakes in the FS. Unfortunately, the GOE do not reflect that, but that's not a surprise to anyone anymore. :rolleyes:Takahashi made a couple mistakes as well ( a fall and a bunch of downgrades).

Sorry, don't see anything wrong with that statement. It's revisionist history to pretend these programs weren't flawed. ;)

Willowway
04-23-2010, 04:44 AM
Yes, others made mistakes. The other fact is that Johnny's program didn't have enough point content to put him where he wanted to be - so he'll focus on other people's mistakes and not his own omissions.

It's funny and I know people will scream about this but a friend of mine who is actually knowledgeable about skating in a way I am not mentioned to me that although you couldn't compare Johnny and Evgeny in almost any valid way because they are so radically different, Johnny's program didn't have any more in the way of transitions, if you really examine the program, than Plushy's.

I found that comment jarring - but of course it did, I responded. And held to that until I looked again and there is was, my friend was quite right. Johnny can focus on everyone else's errors, it doesn't mention his omissions and the point potential of his program as compared to the competition. Given the point potential, he really never went out there to win it - because he couldn't have unless a lot of other people tanked. He was placed about where he should have been; had he skated (just as nicely) a more challenging program, the result would have been quite different.

But the public stance is that it was everything - sexual orientation discrimination, geographical distribution of the podium - but his own performance that determined his fate. That's way too much spin for me and why I commented.

psycho
04-23-2010, 04:55 AM
Yes, others made mistakes. The other fact is that Johnny's program didn't have enough point content to put him where he wanted to be - so he'll focus on other people's mistakes.
Look at the base values. They are almost the same. And Weir's execution was cleaner.


It's funny and I know people will scream about this but a friend of mine who is actually a skating insider and knowledgeable in the way I am not mentioned to me that although you couldn't compare Johnny and Evgeny in almost any valid way because they are so different, Johnny's program didn't have any more in the way of transitions, if you really examine the program, than Plushy's.
Well, my expert knowledgeable friend said that Lysacek and Weir had pretty much equal transition content as well, so I guess all 3 of them are even on that one ;)

Johnny can focus on everyone else's errors, it doesn't mention his omissions.
:rolleyes:

Jaana
04-23-2010, 08:33 AM
Yes, others made mistakes. The other fact is that Johnny's program didn't have enough point content to put him where he wanted to be - so he'll focus on other people's mistakes and not his own omissions.

Weir was not faultless either, he lost points in a spin and triple flip. His freeskate PCS was not as high it could have been, if he had skated to a good CoP programme including transitions and a more challenging choreography. Now the programme was beautiful, but empty. On the other hand Weir´s jumping in the freeskate was more successful than I have seen from him for a long time. Such a pity that he did not skate in this way at 2006 Olympics, where he still would have got away with it, LOL. In 2010 Olympics it was way too late...

In technical elements Weir was a bit ahead of Lambiel, Chan and Takahashi, but rightfully he lost in PCS because of his less challenging and empty freeskate programme. And also in base value Weir lost a bit to Lambiel and Chan:

http://www.isuresults.com/results/owg2010/owg10_Men_FS_Scores.pdf

About Weir I have to say that he is at his best while playing the role of a victim. One has seen that performance from him many, many times. Always somebody else is to be blamed, he never admits that the fault actually could be his own.

Japanfan
04-23-2010, 09:14 AM
About Weir I have to say that he is at his best while playing the role of a victim. One has seen that performance from him many, many times. Always somebody else is to be blamed, he never admits that the fault actually could be his own.

ITA. And not only are Johnny's program empty as compared to others (Chan, Lambiel, and Takahashi), but the quality of his skating has declined somewhat over the past few years.

His seems far more passionate about being a celebrity than about being a skater.

Fair enough that's he's not really comfortable with the new system, but he should admit. Joubert has finely come round to acknowledging his responsibility for his skating and accepting his CoP placements. It took him awhile, but that shift in viewpoint has been necessary for him to continue competing and make what improvements he can.

Johnny doesn't want to learn, change, or take responsibility. For that reason I am wondering if he will continue competing.

Snowgirl
04-23-2010, 04:16 PM
Fair enough that's he's not really comfortable with the new system, but he should admit. Joubert has finely come round to acknowledging his responsibility for his skating and accepting his CoP placements. It took him awhile, but that shift in viewpoint has been necessary for him to continue competing and make what improvements he can.

Johnny doesn't want to learn, change, or take responsibility. For that reason I am wondering if he will continue competing.

That is not true. Johnny admits that he does his flip from the wrong edge and says it's unlikely correctable. He admitted having troubles with maxing out combos and admitted his losses because of omitted 2T. He didn't blame anyone but himself. He worked on it and maxed out his combos at the Olympics.

kwanfan1818
04-23-2010, 06:58 PM
In 6.0 thinking, there would be no edge call with a mandatory deduction, and Weir's only bad element would have had a flawed spin. But, on the other hand, there wouldn't have been two under-rotation calls and two edge calls on Takahashi, and who knows how many courage points he would have gotten for the attempted quad vs. Weir's very good 2A.

Is Weir actually complaining that Plushenko was over-marked for some dodgy air positions and landings and skating without his pre-2010 power and speed? For having a comparably empty program as Weir, but scoring 5.7 points higher in PCS? Somehow I doubt this.

If he thinks his FS would have been marked higher than Lysacek's, especially given the strength of Lysacek's ending, which was pretty influential under 6.0, I'm not sure what he's smoking. Lysacek's TES were about 6% higher than Weir's in total.

Lambiel had a -6.12 GOE deficit on having five flawed jump elements of eight; he only had +GOE on the 3S and 2A. He made up this deficit almost twice: much of it on his spins and footwork, and once on PCS. Since Lambiel has routinely beaten cleaner skaters with FS's with some flawed jumps for over half a decade, that's a substantial difference that I don't think can be explained by the system or a single panel of judges or an email from Joseph Inman.

Which leaves Chan, and with 6.0 thinking, Weir will win the technical argument (at least) by having landed more clean jumps. The rest is a lot of noise to complain that he was scored under Chan again.

Carolla5501
04-24-2010, 12:03 AM
I am not saying he might now should have placed higher, but.... I don't see him as a Gold or Silver medalist based on the skate he gave. I somehow don't think that Sundance is going to spend much time on places 4 and 5... I expect "why Johnny didn't medal" will be the issue and those skates were not "filled" with mistakes.

There's not much drama if you don't do a "wuz robbed" on the medals.

jlai
04-24-2010, 02:35 AM
He didn't blame anyone but himself. He worked on it and maxed out his combos at the Olympics.



Wonderwall: Can you share an example of something in your upcoming memoir that wasn't covered in the press?
JW: Well, the book is going to be about me and my story and how I got to where I am. I'm going to deal with some of my past relationships, sexual and not. I'm going to talk about the politics and the behind-the-scenes dealings of figure skating which, even though people donąt necessarily think of it when they're watching figure skating, it's definitely there. Because of politics I wasn't an Olympic medalist so there's a lot that I have to talk about.


So basically he thinks he's robbed of a medal. I also heard him saying he skated clean yadiyadah but errr...that booboo on that spin?


I am not saying he might now should have placed higher, but.... I don't see him as a Gold or Silver medalist based on the skate he gave. I somehow don't think that Sundance is going to spend much time on places 4 and 5... I expect "why Johnny didn't medal" will be the issue and those skates were not "filled" with mistakes.

There's not much drama if you don't do a "wuz robbed" on the medals.

True.

I don't know what happened to the Johnny who had such beautiful 3As and runouts on jump landings. This year he's landing jumps but I no longer see the 2004 Johnny Weir in him--the runout, the smoothness... :(